Home - Back

caltrops and steel bars

- [Previous Topic] [Next Topic]
#5128 [2004-08-09 19:59:15]

caltrops and steel bars

by samurai_dokoro

I read the ten misconceptions about the samurai. the one that talks
about the ninjas fascinated me. it's only now that i learned that
ninja-to swords are of hollywood creation, and so did i learn that
ninjas do not only rely on shuriken for throwing barbs but also use
knives, etc. my question is that is it really true that ninjas also
use steel bars to pry open shut and locked doors? is it also true
that they use caltrops to injure or even kill their pursuers?

[Next #5130]

#5130 [2004-08-10 02:18:11]

Re: [samuraihistory] caltrops and steel bars

by umaryu

HI

I think the straight sword was more a creation of
Steve Hayes in the late 70's and early 80's. He ghost
wrote a book called Ninjutsu history and traditons
which was a butchered version of a book by his teacher
Hatsumi masaaki called Sengoku Ninpo Zukan which is a
wonderful work on ninjutsu. Its a shame he wrote
something that is only 50% accurate

The ninja were not all alike, in fact depending on
there location and period in history that each school
exisited there skills could be greatly different. For
instance there is one school recorded that used young
girls to sleep with passing high ranking samurai to
use sex for information, they have no fighting skills.
Then there are schools such as Iga ryu which would
have had amassive variety of skills fomr Taijutsu
(jujutsu) to spear, sword, maybe even explosives at
some point.

As for holding doors open.

Many of these schools would have had items they could
use for opening doors such as the kunai, and also
metal spikes that could lock a door shut ot keep it
open by 'nailing' it into place.

Caltrops when made of metal are called Tetsubishi and
when dropped always fall with one spike upwards. there
are also natural plant seeds that worked the same
(forgot the name).

Many ninja things are not exclusive to the ninja.
Samurai would involve the same items as well if
needed. Also some skills are not solely ninja only.
For instance the negoro ryu of Ninjutsu was a school
that specialised in the use of the gun, but so did
some samurai schools. This school just made itself a
specialist in this field.

Today ninjutsu is as good as dead, there are many good
historians and even some practioners in the modern
aspects of the art. What can be classed as old style
ninjutsu is long gone, and I speak of this as an
instructor of the Bujinkan dojo which pushed the
Ninjutsu boom in the 80's. It is a long time now since
I pushed ninjutsu aside and just look on it now as a
area of interest for reading. I prefer the samurai
aspects of the bujinkan

Anything you see in a western movie that involves
ninja is as good as 95% inaccurate, japanese movies
etc are also not accurate.

Paul



--- samurai_dokoro <samurai_dokoro@...> wrote:


---------------------------------
I read the ten misconceptions about the samurai. the
one that talks
about the ninjas fascinated me. it's only now that i
learned that
ninja-to swords are of hollywood creation, and so did
i learn that
ninjas do not only rely on shuriken for throwing barbs
but also use
knives, etc. my question is that is it really true
that ninjas also
use steel bars to pry open shut and locked doors? is
it also true
that they use caltrops to injure or even kill their
pursuers?




---
Samurai Archives: http://www.samurai-archives.com
Samurai Archives store:
http://www.cafeshops.com/samuraiarchives
---


Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT


---------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/samuraihistory/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
samuraihistory-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
Terms of Service.





__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Address AutoComplete - You start. We finish.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

[Previous #5128] [Next #5134]

#5134 [2004-08-10 16:30:33]

Re: [samuraihistory] caltrops and steel bars

by ltdomer98

--- samurai_dokoro <samurai_dokoro@...> wrote:

my question is that is it really true
> that ninjas also
> use steel bars to pry open shut and locked doors?

You mean, like a crowbar? Um, yeah. But that's hardly
a "ninja" tool.

is
> it also true
> that they use caltrops to injure or even kill their
> pursuers?

Well, according to the ninja museum in Iga-Ueno, yes.
I'm not sure about "killing" them--I'm assuming you
mean poisoning the caltrops, because I don't see how
else it could kill anybody. They did use them, quite a
few varieties, in fact.
>
>




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Address AutoComplete - You start. We finish.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

[Previous #5130] [Next #5136]

#5136 [2004-08-10 16:37:18]

Re: [samuraihistory] caltrops and steel bars

by ltdomer98

--- Richardson Paul <umaryu@...> wrote:

>
> Anything you see in a western movie that involves
> ninja is as good as 95% inaccurate, japanese movies
> etc are also not accurate.
>
> Paul

You mean I can't disappear or hypnotize my enemy by
shouting incantations, like in Owl's Castle?

Dang.



__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail is new and improved - Check it out!
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

[Previous #5134] [Next #5141]

#5141 [2004-08-10 23:10:11]

Re: [samuraihistory] caltrops and steel bars

by umaryu

if you start shouting incantations I iwll disapear LOL


--- Nate Ledbetter <ltdomer98@...> wrote:


---------------------------------

--- Richardson Paul <umaryu@...> wrote:

>
> Anything you see in a western movie that involves
> ninja is as good as 95% inaccurate, japanese movies
> etc are also not accurate.
>
> Paul

You mean I can't disappear or hypnotize my enemy by
shouting incantations, like in Owl's Castle?

Dang.



__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail is new and improved - Check it out!
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail


---
Samurai Archives: http://www.samurai-archives.com
Samurai Archives store:
http://www.cafeshops.com/samuraiarchives
---


Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT


---------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/samuraihistory/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
samuraihistory-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
Terms of Service.






__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage!
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

[Previous #5136] [Next #5149]

#5149 [2004-08-11 06:23:11]

Re: [samuraihistory] caltrops and steel bars

by edyhiphop

Sorry for saying a stupid question but what are caltrops?????And what are those small discs with very sharp edges?????(how are they called)

Edy

Nate Ledbetter <ltdomer98@...> wrote:

--- samurai_dokoro <samurai_dokoro@...> wrote:

my question is that is it really true
> that ninjas also
> use steel bars to pry open shut and locked doors?

You mean, like a crowbar? Um, yeah. But that's hardly
a "ninja" tool.

is
> it also true
> that they use caltrops to injure or even kill their
> pursuers?

Well, according to the ninja museum in Iga-Ueno, yes.
I'm not sure about "killing" them--I'm assuming you
mean poisoning the caltrops, because I don't see how
else it could kill anybody. They did use them, quite a
few varieties, in fact.
>
>




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Address AutoComplete - You start. We finish.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail


---
Samurai Archives: http://www.samurai-archives.com
Samurai Archives store: http://www.cafeshops.com/samuraiarchives
---


Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT


---------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/samuraihistory/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
samuraihistory-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



HIP-HOP Man!!!


---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - Send 10MB messages!

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Previous #5141] [Next #5154]

#5154 [2004-08-11 15:50:08]

Re: [samuraihistory] caltrops and steel bars

by ltdomer98

--- Edward Alexander <edyhiphop@...> wrote:

> Sorry for saying a stupid question but what are
> caltrops?????And what are those small discs with
> very sharp edges?????(how are they called)
>
> Edy

Caltrops are spikes placed/strewn on the ground to
impede/distract a pursuer, etc. The general shape of
"tetsubishi" ("iron diamonds") is a 4 pointed object
with the points such that if you throw them down,
there is always one point up and 3 points as a base.
Think of jacks, from the kids game, except sharper.

The small discs with the sharp edges you refer to are
shuriken. There's several names according to the
shape, etc., and I'm sure one of our resident ninja
masters will pipe up and tell us, but I'm not sure
what all they are. I know under the heading of
"shuriken", you've got all sorts of shapes and sizes
of throwing knives, including the disc and star shaped
types.







__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

[Previous #5149] [Next #5159]

#5159 [2004-08-12 00:56:30]

Re: [samuraihistory] caltrops and steel bars

by edyhiphop

Thanx.I heard and read about those discs(shuriken) so I wanted to know what are they called.But what's the purpose of the shuriken????

Edy

Nate Ledbetter <ltdomer98@...> wrote:

--- Edward Alexander <edyhiphop@...> wrote:

> Sorry for saying a stupid question but what are
> caltrops?????And what are those small discs with
> very sharp edges?????(how are they called)
>
> Edy

Caltrops are spikes placed/strewn on the ground to
impede/distract a pursuer, etc. The general shape of
"tetsubishi" ("iron diamonds") is a 4 pointed object
with the points such that if you throw them down,
there is always one point up and 3 points as a base.
Think of jacks, from the kids game, except sharper.

The small discs with the sharp edges you refer to are
shuriken. There's several names according to the
shape, etc., and I'm sure one of our resident ninja
masters will pipe up and tell us, but I'm not sure
what all they are. I know under the heading of
"shuriken", you've got all sorts of shapes and sizes
of throwing knives, including the disc and star shaped
types.







__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail


---
Samurai Archives: http://www.samurai-archives.com
Samurai Archives store: http://www.cafeshops.com/samuraiarchives
---


Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT


---------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/samuraihistory/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
samuraihistory-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



HIP-HOP Man!!!


---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail is new and improved - Check it out!

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Previous #5154] [Next #5162]

#5162 [2004-08-12 01:28:14]

Re: [samuraihistory] caltrops and steel bars

by umaryu

Hi

if you want to know about shuriken May i suggets you
look at this site. I would says its the most
informatve on the wbe

http://www.aikidoaus.com.au/dojo/shuriken/index.htm

Paul


--- Edward Alexander <edyhiphop@...> wrote:


---------------------------------
Thanx.I heard and read about those discs(shuriken) so
I wanted to know what are they called.But what's the
purpose of the shuriken????

Edy

Nate Ledbetter <ltdomer98@...> wrote:

--- Edward Alexander <edyhiphop@...> wrote:

> Sorry for saying a stupid question but what are
> caltrops?????And what are those small discs with
> very sharp edges?????(how are they called)
>
> Edy

Caltrops are spikes placed/strewn on the ground to
impede/distract a pursuer, etc. The general shape of
"tetsubishi" ("iron diamonds") is a 4 pointed object
with the points such that if you throw them down,
there is always one point up and 3 points as a base.
Think of jacks, from the kids game, except sharper.

The small discs with the sharp edges you refer to are
shuriken. There's several names according to the
shape, etc., and I'm sure one of our resident ninja
masters will pipe up and tell us, but I'm not sure
what all they are. I know under the heading of
"shuriken", you've got all sorts of shapes and sizes
of throwing knives, including the disc and star shaped
types.







__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail


---
Samurai Archives: http://www.samurai-archives.com
Samurai Archives store:
http://www.cafeshops.com/samuraiarchives
---


Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT


---------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/samuraihistory/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
samuraihistory-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
Terms of Service.



HIP-HOP Man!!!


---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail is new and improved - Check it out!

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




---
Samurai Archives: http://www.samurai-archives.com
Samurai Archives store:
http://www.cafeshops.com/samuraiarchives
---


Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT


---------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/samuraihistory/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
samuraihistory-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
Terms of Service.





__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

[Previous #5159] [Next #5165]

#5165 [2004-08-12 01:35:49]

Re: [samuraihistory] caltrops and steel bars

by ltdomer98

--- Edward Alexander <edyhiphop@...> wrote:

> Thanx.I heard and read about those discs(shuriken)
> so I wanted to know what are they called.But what's
> the purpose of the shuriken????
>

You throw it to hurt people.




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage!
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

[Previous #5162]


Made with