Re: - HOGEN INCIDENT

Jonathan, just an "off the cuff" thought - is the Hogen Incident the basis
of the film "Gate of Hell" ("Jigokumon", 1953, directed by Teinosuke
Kinugasa)??? The list seems to be a little quiet at present so I'll be
indulgent and ramble on a bit about this film, one of my favourites.

A thoroughly enjoyable movie, one reviewer commenting "Kinugasa's sublime
control of color intensifies every emotion in his Academy Award®-winning
masterpiece, a classic 12th-century tale about a warrior whose love
dishonors a married woman. The screen is steeped in fiery reds for chaotic
battle scenes, then blanketed in soothing images of white-kimonoed priests
beside a calm blue sea. The exquisite compositions and charged performances
of Kazuo Hasegawa and Machiko Kyo depict a culture dedicated to order, yet
easily rocked by passion.".

Another reviwer
http://www.amazon.com/Gate-Hell-Teinosuke-Kinugasa/dp/6303073093 comments:

In 1953, Teinosuke Kinugasa (1896-1982) directed and co-adapted the
historical play entitled "Jigokumon" (English transliteration of the
Japanese title), which was written by Kan Kikuchi (1888-1948). The film's
name (the same as the play) translates into English as "Gate of Hell", and
was released theatrically in the U.S. in 1954. The story takes place in
12th-century Japan during the Heian period and at the start of a revolt.
During the confusion and fear running rampant through the royal palace in
Kyoto, a lady of the court, Lady Kesa (Machiko Kyo), is rescued by a soldier
named Moritoh (Kazuo Hasegawa, 1908-1984). After the revolt fails, Moritoh
is told that he can have anything that he wants, and what he wants is Lady
Kesa to be his wife. He is quickly told, however, that she is already
married to Wataru Watanabe (Isao Yamagata, 1915-1996). Rather than seek
something different, Moritoh becomes dangerously obsessed with Lady Kesa.
Filmed in beautiful & vibrant color (probably one of the first color films
from Japan), the cinematography in "Gate of Hell" is exquisite. The story is
by no means dated, though it does become somewhat predictable. Still, it is
both compelling and engaging and the acting is superb, especially Machiko
Ky. Memorable scenes in the film include the confusion at the royal palace,
Laky Kesa hiding from traitorous soldiers, Moritoh meeting Lady Kesa and her
aunt after the revolt, Moritoh given the choice of his heart's desire, the
horse races, Moritoh at the home of Lady Kesa's aunt, and the ending scenes.
The makeup used on Moritoh could have been better.

The film won several awards including an Oscar for Best Costume Design, an
Honorary Academy Award for Best Foreign Language Film and the prestigious
Grand Prize at the Cannes Film Festival in France. Overall, I rate "Gate of
Hell" with 4 out of 5 stars. Hopefully, the film will be fully restored and
released on DVD one day. I highly recommend the film.

Best regards,

Barry Thomas.

----- Original Message -----

From: "jonathan ellgen" <jpellgen@...>
To: <samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 9:28 AM
Subject: Re: [samuraihistory]


>I am working on a section of my master's thesis dealing with the Hogen
>Incident. I was wondering if anyone has any additional sources for
>information about Uno Chikahara. It isn't vital, but I thought it couldn't
>hurt to ask.
>
> Thanks everybody,
>
> Jonathan P. Ellgen

Thanks for your reply... I will have to check on that film. I am always interested in Japanese film, especially if it is relevant to my study.

Also, thanks for mentioning that study. It may help depending on the content. My research is actually on seppuku and the Edo Period, but, in the process, I am comparing several examples ranging from the war chronicles to Yukio Mishima. I would be happy to share my work with anyone who is interested once it is finished--as long as it isnt bashed too much ;)

I am specifically looking for text resources other than the Hogen Monogatari. Hogen Monogatari only seems to cover Uno Chikahara briefly. This short passage contains a reference to seppuku which is believed to be the first in the war chronicles. I was hoping to find some information about this individual, but have come up empty so far.

Jonathan P. Ellgen

Barry Thomas <warlord@...> wrote: Jonathan, just an "off the cuff" thought - is the Hogen Incident the basis
of the film "Gate of Hell" ("Jigokumon", 1953, directed by Teinosuke
Kinugasa)??? The list seems to be a little quiet at present so I'll be
indulgent and ramble on a bit about this film, one of my favourites.

A thoroughly enjoyable movie, one reviewer commenting "Kinugasa's sublime
control of color intensifies every emotion in his Academy Award®-winning
masterpiece, a classic 12th-century tale about a warrior whose love
dishonors a married woman. The screen is steeped in fiery reds for chaotic
battle scenes, then blanketed in soothing images of white-kimonoed priests
beside a calm blue sea. The exquisite compositions and charged performances
of Kazuo Hasegawa and Machiko Kyo depict a culture dedicated to order, yet
easily rocked by passion.".

Another reviwer
http://www.amazon.com/Gate-Hell-Teinosuke-Kinugasa/dp/6303073093 comments:

In 1953, Teinosuke Kinugasa (1896-1982) directed and co-adapted the
historical play entitled "Jigokumon" (English transliteration of the
Japanese title), which was written by Kan Kikuchi (1888-1948). The film's
name (the same as the play) translates into English as "Gate of Hell", and
was released theatrically in the U.S. in 1954. The story takes place in
12th-century Japan during the Heian period and at the start of a revolt.
During the confusion and fear running rampant through the royal palace in
Kyoto, a lady of the court, Lady Kesa (Machiko Kyo), is rescued by a soldier
named Moritoh (Kazuo Hasegawa, 1908-1984). After the revolt fails, Moritoh
is told that he can have anything that he wants, and what he wants is Lady
Kesa to be his wife. He is quickly told, however, that she is already
married to Wataru Watanabe (Isao Yamagata, 1915-1996). Rather than seek
something different, Moritoh becomes dangerously obsessed with Lady Kesa.
Filmed in beautiful & vibrant color (probably one of the first color films
from Japan), the cinematography in "Gate of Hell" is exquisite. The story is
by no means dated, though it does become somewhat predictable. Still, it is
both compelling and engaging and the acting is superb, especially Machiko
Ky. Memorable scenes in the film include the confusion at the royal palace,
Laky Kesa hiding from traitorous soldiers, Moritoh meeting Lady Kesa and her
aunt after the revolt, Moritoh given the choice of his heart's desire, the
horse races, Moritoh at the home of Lady Kesa's aunt, and the ending scenes.
The makeup used on Moritoh could have been better.

The film won several awards including an Oscar for Best Costume Design, an
Honorary Academy Award for Best Foreign Language Film and the prestigious
Grand Prize at the Cannes Film Festival in France. Overall, I rate "Gate of
Hell" with 4 out of 5 stars. Hopefully, the film will be fully restored and
released on DVD one day. I highly recommend the film.

Best regards,

Barry Thomas.

----- Original Message -----

From: "jonathan ellgen" <jpellgen@...>
To: <samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 9:28 AM
Subject: Re: [samuraihistory]

>I am working on a section of my master's thesis dealing with the Hogen
>Incident. I was wondering if anyone has any additional sources for
>information about Uno Chikahara. It isn't vital, but I thought it couldn't
>hurt to ask.
>
> Thanks everybody,
>
> Jonathan P. Ellgen





__________________________________________________
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Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I'd love to see your finished work. Perhaps you might want to put a link to it in the Edo Period section of the Samurai Archives Citadel.

Speaking of film and seppuku: I've brought this up before. But Kobayashi's film SEPPUKU discussed incidents of early Edo-period ronin from disbanded clans coming to clan gateways to request a spot to commit seppuku. In the film, the main fictional character (Tsugumo Hanshiro) mention a name of a ronin who came to the Sengoku clan's gateway (unfortunately, the man's name mentioned in the film has escaped me at the moment). This ronin told the clan leaders that he preferred to commit seppuku rather than live on in endless poverty. The Sengoku clan leaders were so impressed that they made him a member of their clan. After that, supposedly scores of impoverished ronin went to clan gates with seppuku requests and the clans would give them "go away" money. Sooner or later most of these seppuku requests were insincere; the ronin involved wanted the money rather than actually wanting to commit seppuku. As many of us know, the film SEPPUKU involves a ronin making such a request -- with tragic consequences.

Anyway, I don't really want to discuss the film. Rather I'm curious to know: did the incident mentioned in the film involving the Sengoku clan actually happen? Or did Kobayashi (and/or novelest Takaguchi) draw a completely fictional event with fictional names out of the hat? I wonder if you're planing to include this in your work.

Nina aka "Wave Tossed" -- Moderator of the Edo Period section of the Samurai Archives Citadel Forum


_____

From: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com [mailto:samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 1:30 AM
To: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [samuraihistory] - HOGEN INCIDENT




Thanks for your reply... I will have to check on that film. I am always interested in Japanese film, especially if it is relevant to my study.

Also, thanks for mentioning that study. It may help depending on the content. My research is actually on seppuku and the Edo Period, but, in the process, I am comparing several examples ranging from the war chronicles to Yukio Mishima. I would be happy to share my work with anyone who is interested once it is finished--as long as it isnt bashed too much ;)

I am specifically looking for text resources other than the Hogen Monogatari. Hogen Monogatari only seems to cover Uno Chikahara briefly. This short passage contains a reference to seppuku which is believed to be the first in the war chronicles. I was hoping to find some information about this individual, but have come up empty so far.

Jonathan P. Ellgen

Barry Thomas net.au> wrote: Jonathan, just an "off the cuff" thought - is the Hogen Incident the basis
of the film "Gate of Hell" ("Jigokumon", 1953, directed by Teinosuke
Kinugasa)??? The list seems to be a little quiet at present so I'll be
indulgent and ramble on a bit about this film, one of my favourites.

A thoroughly enjoyable movie, one reviewer commenting "Kinugasa's sublime
control of color intensifies every emotion in his Academy Award®-winning
masterpiece, a classic 12th-century tale about a warrior whose love
dishonors a married woman. The screen is steeped in fiery reds for chaotic
battle scenes, then blanketed in soothing images of white-kimonoed priests
beside a calm blue sea. The exquisite compositions and charged performances
of Kazuo Hasegawa and Machiko Kyo depict a culture dedicated to order, yet
easily rocked by passion.".

Another reviwer
http://www.amazon. com/Gate-Hell-Teinosuke-Kinugasa/dp/6303073093 comments:

In 1953, Teinosuke Kinugasa (1896-1982) directed and co-adapted the
historical play entitled "Jigokumon" (English transliteration of the
Japanese title), which was written by Kan Kikuchi (1888-1948). The film's
name (the same as the play) translates into English as "Gate of Hell", and
was released theatrically in the U.S. in 1954. The story takes place in
12th-century Japan during the Heian period and at the start of a revolt.
During the confusion and fear running rampant through the royal palace in
Kyoto, a lady of the court, Lady Kesa (Machiko Kyo), is rescued by a soldier
named Moritoh (Kazuo Hasegawa, 1908-1984). After the revolt fails, Moritoh
is told that he can have anything that he wants, and what he wants is Lady
Kesa to be his wife. He is quickly told, however, that she is already
married to Wataru Watanabe (Isao Yamagata, 1915-1996). Rather than seek
something different, Moritoh becomes dangerously obsessed with Lady Kesa.
Filmed in beautiful & vibrant color (probably one of the first color films
from Japan), the cinematography in "Gate of Hell" is exquisite. The story is
by no means dated, though it does become somewhat predictable. Still, it is
both compelling and engaging and the acting is superb, especially Machiko
Ky. Memorable scenes in the film include the confusion at the royal palace,
Laky Kesa hiding from traitorous soldiers, Moritoh meeting Lady Kesa and her
aunt after the revolt, Moritoh given the choice of his heart's desire, the
horse races, Moritoh at the home of Lady Kesa's aunt, and the ending scenes.
The makeup used on Moritoh could have been better.

The film won several awards including an Oscar for Best Costume Design, an
Honorary Academy Award for Best Foreign Language Film and the prestigious
Grand Prize at the Cannes Film Festival in France. Overall, I rate "Gate of
Hell" with 4 out of 5 stars. Hopefully, the film will be fully restored and
released on DVD one day. I highly recommend the film.

Best regards,

Barry Thomas.

----- Original Message -----

From: "jonathan ellgen" com>
To: yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 9:28 AM
Subject: Re: [samuraihistory]

>I am working on a section of my master's thesis dealing with the Hogen
>Incident. I was wondering if anyone has any additional sources for
>information about Uno Chikahara. It isn't vital, but I thought it couldn't
>hurt to ask.
>
> Thanks everybody,
>
> Jonathan P. Ellgen





__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail. yahoo.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Thats an interesting question... But it seems quite possible that this may have been the case. Actually, I had not planned to cover this but it would be an excellent addition if I have time to recearch it.

My skills at reading Japanese are limited, but there is a book by Hirofumi Yamamoto (Seppuku: Nihonjin no Sekinin no Torikata). that has about 400 examples of seppuku during the Edo Period--could be in there. I have been getting some translations of from Dr. Stephen Taguchi from the University of Northern Alabama, but I haven't come across that particular story. I will look into that as soon as I can. I am extremely interested in this. I can't believe I havent seen anything about this yet.

Jonathan P. Ellgen

"Boal, Nina" wrote: I'd love to see your finished work. Perhaps you might want to put a link to it in the Edo Period section of the Samurai Archives Citadel.

Speaking of film and seppuku: I've brought this up before. But Kobayashi's film SEPPUKU discussed incidents of early Edo-period ronin from disbanded clans coming to clan gateways to request a spot to commit seppuku. In the film, the main fictional character (Tsugumo Hanshiro) mention a name of a ronin who came to the Sengoku clan's gateway (unfortunately, the man's name mentioned in the film has escaped me at the moment). This ronin told the clan leaders that he preferred to commit seppuku rather than live on in endless poverty. The Sengoku clan leaders were so impressed that they made him a member of their clan. After that, supposedly scores of impoverished ronin went to clan gates with seppuku requests and the clans would give them "go away" money. Sooner or later most of these seppuku requests were insincere; the ronin involved wanted the money rather than actually wanting to commit seppuku. As many of us know, the film SEPPUKU involves a ronin making such a request --
with tragic consequences.

Anyway, I don't really want to discuss the film. Rather I'm curious to know: did the incident mentioned in the film involving the Sengoku clan actually happen? Or did Kobayashi (and/or novelest Takaguchi) draw a completely fictional event with fictional names out of the hat? I wonder if you're planing to include this in your work.

Nina aka "Wave Tossed" -- Moderator of the Edo Period section of the Samurai Archives Citadel Forum

_____

From: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com [mailto:samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 1:30 AM
To: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [samuraihistory] - HOGEN INCIDENT

Thanks for your reply... I will have to check on that film. I am always interested in Japanese film, especially if it is relevant to my study.

Also, thanks for mentioning that study. It may help depending on the content. My research is actually on seppuku and the Edo Period, but, in the process, I am comparing several examples ranging from the war chronicles to Yukio Mishima. I would be happy to share my work with anyone who is interested once it is finished--as long as it isnt bashed too much ;)

I am specifically looking for text resources other than the Hogen Monogatari. Hogen Monogatari only seems to cover Uno Chikahara briefly. This short passage contains a reference to seppuku which is believed to be the first in the war chronicles. I was hoping to find some information about this individual, but have come up empty so far.

Jonathan P. Ellgen

Barry Thomas net.au> wrote: Jonathan, just an "off the cuff" thought - is the Hogen Incident the basis
of the film "Gate of Hell" ("Jigokumon", 1953, directed by Teinosuke
Kinugasa)??? The list seems to be a little quiet at present so I'll be
indulgent and ramble on a bit about this film, one of my favourites.

A thoroughly enjoyable movie, one reviewer commenting "Kinugasa's sublime
control of color intensifies every emotion in his Academy Award®-winning
masterpiece, a classic 12th-century tale about a warrior whose love
dishonors a married woman. The screen is steeped in fiery reds for chaotic
battle scenes, then blanketed in soothing images of white-kimonoed priests
beside a calm blue sea. The exquisite compositions and charged performances
of Kazuo Hasegawa and Machiko Kyo depict a culture dedicated to order, yet
easily rocked by passion.".

Another reviwer
http://www.amazon. com/Gate-Hell-Teinosuke-Kinugasa/dp/6303073093 comments:

In 1953, Teinosuke Kinugasa (1896-1982) directed and co-adapted the
historical play entitled "Jigokumon" (English transliteration of the
Japanese title), which was written by Kan Kikuchi (1888-1948). The film's
name (the same as the play) translates into English as "Gate of Hell", and
was released theatrically in the U.S. in 1954. The story takes place in
12th-century Japan during the Heian period and at the start of a revolt.
During the confusion and fear running rampant through the royal palace in
Kyoto, a lady of the court, Lady Kesa (Machiko Kyo), is rescued by a soldier
named Moritoh (Kazuo Hasegawa, 1908-1984). After the revolt fails, Moritoh
is told that he can have anything that he wants, and what he wants is Lady
Kesa to be his wife. He is quickly told, however, that she is already
married to Wataru Watanabe (Isao Yamagata, 1915-1996). Rather than seek
something different, Moritoh becomes dangerously obsessed with Lady Kesa.
Filmed in beautiful & vibrant color (probably one of the first color films
from Japan), the cinematography in "Gate of Hell" is exquisite. The story is
by no means dated, though it does become somewhat predictable. Still, it is
both compelling and engaging and the acting is superb, especially Machiko
Ky. Memorable scenes in the film include the confusion at the royal palace,
Laky Kesa hiding from traitorous soldiers, Moritoh meeting Lady Kesa and her
aunt after the revolt, Moritoh given the choice of his heart's desire, the
horse races, Moritoh at the home of Lady Kesa's aunt, and the ending scenes.
The makeup used on Moritoh could have been better.

The film won several awards including an Oscar for Best Costume Design, an
Honorary Academy Award for Best Foreign Language Film and the prestigious
Grand Prize at the Cannes Film Festival in France. Overall, I rate "Gate of
Hell" with 4 out of 5 stars. Hopefully, the film will be fully restored and
released on DVD one day. I highly recommend the film.

Best regards,

Barry Thomas.

----- Original Message -----

From: "jonathan ellgen" com>
To: yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 9:28 AM
Subject: Re: [samuraihistory]

>I am working on a section of my master's thesis dealing with the Hogen
>Incident. I was wondering if anyone has any additional sources for
>information about Uno Chikahara. It isn't vital, but I thought it couldn't
>hurt to ask.
>
> Thanks everybody,
>
> Jonathan P. Ellgen

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail. yahoo.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






---------------------------------
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

about seppuku(the film):Ii clan chronicles dont mention any such
incident.so,its possible that its pure fiction...regards tengu64

>From: "Boal, Nina"
>Reply-To: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
>To:
>Subject: Research on Seppuku (was RE: [samuraihistory] - HOGEN INCIDENT)
>Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2006 08:13:18 -0400
>
>I'd love to see your finished work. Perhaps you might want to put a link to
>it in the Edo Period section of the Samurai Archives Citadel.
>
>Speaking of film and seppuku: I've brought this up before. But Kobayashi's
>film SEPPUKU discussed incidents of early Edo-period ronin from disbanded
>clans coming to clan gateways to request a spot to commit seppuku. In the
>film, the main fictional character (Tsugumo Hanshiro) mention a name of a
>ronin who came to the Sengoku clan's gateway (unfortunately, the man's name
>mentioned in the film has escaped me at the moment). This ronin told the
>clan leaders that he preferred to commit seppuku rather than live on in
>endless poverty. The Sengoku clan leaders were so impressed that they made
>him a member of their clan. After that, supposedly scores of impoverished
>ronin went to clan gates with seppuku requests and the clans would give
>them "go away" money. Sooner or later most of these seppuku requests were
>insincere; the ronin involved wanted the money rather than actually wanting
>to commit seppuku. As many of us know, the film SEPPUKU involves a ronin
>making such a request -- with tragic consequences.
>
>Anyway, I don't really want to discuss the film. Rather I'm curious to
>know: did the incident mentioned in the film involving the Sengoku clan
>actually happen? Or did Kobayashi (and/or novelest Takaguchi) draw a
>completely fictional event with fictional names out of the hat? I wonder if
>you're planing to include this in your work.
>
>Nina aka "Wave Tossed" -- Moderator of the Edo Period section of the
>Samurai Archives Citadel Forum
>
>
> _____
>
>From: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
>[mailto:samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com]
>Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 1:30 AM
>To: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: [samuraihistory] - HOGEN INCIDENT
>
>
>
>
>Thanks for your reply... I will have to check on that film. I am always
>interested in Japanese film, especially if it is relevant to my study.
>
>Also, thanks for mentioning that study. It may help depending on the
>content. My research is actually on seppuku and the Edo Period, but, in the
>process, I am comparing several examples ranging from the war chronicles to
>Yukio Mishima. I would be happy to share my work with anyone who is
>interested once it is finished--as long as it isnt bashed too much ;)
>
>I am specifically looking for text resources other than the Hogen
>Monogatari. Hogen Monogatari only seems to cover Uno Chikahara briefly.
>This short passage contains a reference to seppuku which is believed to be
>the first in the war chronicles. I was hoping to find some information
>about this individual, but have come up empty so far.
>
>Jonathan P. Ellgen
>
>Barry Thomas net.au> wrote:
>Jonathan, just an "off the cuff" thought - is the Hogen Incident the basis
>of the film "Gate of Hell" ("Jigokumon", 1953, directed by Teinosuke
>Kinugasa)??? The list seems to be a little quiet at present so I'll be
>indulgent and ramble on a bit about this film, one of my favourites.
>
>A thoroughly enjoyable movie, one reviewer commenting "Kinugasa's sublime
>control of color intensifies every emotion in his Academy Award®-winning
>masterpiece, a classic 12th-century tale about a warrior whose love
>dishonors a married woman. The screen is steeped in fiery reds for chaotic
>battle scenes, then blanketed in soothing images of white-kimonoed priests
>beside a calm blue sea. The exquisite compositions and charged performances
>of Kazuo Hasegawa and Machiko Kyo depict a culture dedicated to order, yet
>easily rocked by passion.".
>
>Another reviwer
>http://www.amazon.
>
>com/Gate-Hell-Teinosuke-Kinugasa/dp/6303073093 comments:
>
>In 1953, Teinosuke Kinugasa (1896-1982) directed and co-adapted the
>historical play entitled "Jigokumon" (English transliteration of the
>Japanese title), which was written by Kan Kikuchi (1888-1948). The film's
>name (the same as the play) translates into English as "Gate of Hell", and
>was released theatrically in the U.S. in 1954. The story takes place in
>12th-century Japan during the Heian period and at the start of a revolt.
>During the confusion and fear running rampant through the royal palace in
>Kyoto, a lady of the court, Lady Kesa (Machiko Kyo), is rescued by a
>soldier
>named Moritoh (Kazuo Hasegawa, 1908-1984). After the revolt fails, Moritoh
>is told that he can have anything that he wants, and what he wants is Lady
>Kesa to be his wife. He is quickly told, however, that she is already
>married to Wataru Watanabe (Isao Yamagata, 1915-1996). Rather than seek
>something different, Moritoh becomes dangerously obsessed with Lady Kesa.
>Filmed in beautiful & vibrant color (probably one of the first color films
>from Japan), the cinematography in "Gate of Hell" is exquisite. The story
>is
>by no means dated, though it does become somewhat predictable. Still, it is
>both compelling and engaging and the acting is superb, especially Machiko
>Ky. Memorable scenes in the film include the confusion at the royal palace,
>Laky Kesa hiding from traitorous soldiers, Moritoh meeting Lady Kesa and
>her
>aunt after the revolt, Moritoh given the choice of his heart's desire, the
>horse races, Moritoh at the home of Lady Kesa's aunt, and the ending
>scenes.
>The makeup used on Moritoh could have been better.
>
>The film won several awards including an Oscar for Best Costume Design, an
>Honorary Academy Award for Best Foreign Language Film and the prestigious
>Grand Prize at the Cannes Film Festival in France. Overall, I rate "Gate of
>Hell" with 4 out of 5 stars. Hopefully, the film will be fully restored and
>released on DVD one day. I highly recommend the film.
>
>Best regards,
>
>Barry Thomas.
>
>----- Original Message -----
>
>From: "jonathan ellgen" com>
>To:
>yahoogroups.com>
>Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 9:28 AM
>Subject: Re: [samuraihistory]
>
> >I am working on a section of my master's thesis dealing with the Hogen
> >Incident. I was wondering if anyone has any additional sources for
> >information about Uno Chikahara. It isn't vital, but I thought it
>couldn't
> >hurt to ask.
> >
> > Thanks everybody,
> >
> > Jonathan P. Ellgen
>
>
>
>
>
>__________________________________________________
>Do You Yahoo!?
>Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
>http://mail. yahoo.com
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
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>
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I'm sure that the events depicted in the film SEPPUKU involving the Ii clan were fictional. The characters were clearly fictional and I believe that the Ii clan was selected by the authors of the script (and the novel the script was based upon) as representative of a powerful clan of that era.

However, what may or may not have actually happened during the Edo period wouldn't be in the Ii clan chronicles, it would be in another clan's chronicles. I always can use another excuse to watch SEPPUKU yet again, as it's my favorite all-time film (in any genre on any topic -- and I do watch a lot of films). So I'll watch it this weekend to see if I can pick up the name of the ronin mentioned in passing in the film. Of course his name could have been fictionalized as could have been the use of the Sengoku clan's name.

The question that would be relevant for research on the topic of seppuku during the Edo period is if there was or was not any incidents where a ronin came to a clan and requested a spot to commit seppuku to avoid a life of poverty -- and if the clan, impressed by his sincerity, took him in as a retainer. What would also be relevant is if any ronin during that period, upon getting word of this incident, took it upon themselves to extort positions and/or money from clans by asking to commit seppuku, expecting to get either a job or "go away" money.

Nina aka "Wave Tossed"


_____

From: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com [mailto:samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Thursday, October 19, 2006 6:27 AM
To: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: Research on Seppuku (was RE: [samuraihistory] - HOGEN INCIDENT)



about seppuku(the film):Ii clan chronicles dont mention any such
incident.so,its possible that its pure fiction...regards tengu64

>From: "Boal, Nina" gov>
>Reply-To: samuraihistory@ yahoogroups.com
>To: yahoogroups.com>
>Subject: Research on Seppuku (was RE: [samuraihistory] - HOGEN INCIDENT)
>Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2006 08:13:18 -0400
>
>I'd love to see your finished work. Perhaps you might want to put a link to
>it in the Edo Period section of the Samurai Archives Citadel.
>
>Speaking of film and seppuku: I've brought this up before. But Kobayashi's
>film SEPPUKU discussed incidents of early Edo-period ronin from disbanded
>clans coming to clan gateways to request a spot to commit seppuku. In the
>film, the main fictional character (Tsugumo Hanshiro) mention a name of a
>ronin who came to the Sengoku clan's gateway (unfortunately, the man's name
>mentioned in the film has escaped me at the moment). This ronin told the
>clan leaders that he preferred to commit seppuku rather than live on in
>endless poverty. The Sengoku clan leaders were so impressed that they made
>him a member of their clan. After that, supposedly scores of impoverished
>ronin went to clan gates with seppuku requests and the clans would give
>them "go away" money. Sooner or later most of these seppuku requests were
>insincere; the ronin involved wanted the money rather than actually wanting
>to commit seppuku. As many of us know, the film SEPPUKU involves a ronin
>making such a request -- with tragic consequences.
>
>Anyway, I don't really want to discuss the film. Rather I'm curious to
>know: did the incident mentioned in the film involving the Sengoku clan
>actually happen? Or did Kobayashi (and/or novelest Takaguchi) draw a
>completely fictional event with fictional names out of the hat? I wonder if
>you're planing to include this in your work.
>
>Nina aka "Wave Tossed" -- Moderator of the Edo Period section of the
>Samurai Archives Citadel Forum
>
>
> _____
>
>From: samuraihistory@ yahoogroups.com
>[mailto:samuraihistory@ yahoogroups.com]
>Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 1:30 AM
>To: samuraihistory@ yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: [samuraihistory] - HOGEN INCIDENT
>
>
>
>
>Thanks for your reply... I will have to check on that film. I am always
>interested in Japanese film, especially if it is relevant to my study.
>
>Also, thanks for mentioning that study. It may help depending on the
>content. My research is actually on seppuku and the Edo Period, but, in the
>process, I am comparing several examples ranging from the war chronicles to
>Yukio Mishima. I would be happy to share my work with anyone who is
>interested once it is finished--as long as it isnt bashed too much ;)
>
>I am specifically looking for text resources other than the Hogen
>Monogatari. Hogen Monogatari only seems to cover Uno Chikahara briefly.
>This short passage contains a reference to seppuku which is believed to be
>the first in the war chronicles. I was hoping to find some information
>about this individual, but have come up empty so far.
>
>Jonathan P. Ellgen
>
>Barry Thomas net.au> wrote:
>Jonathan, just an "off the cuff" thought - is the Hogen Incident the basis
>of the film "Gate of Hell" ("Jigokumon", 1953, directed by Teinosuke
>Kinugasa)??? The list seems to be a little quiet at present so I'll be
>indulgent and ramble on a bit about this film, one of my favourites.
>
>A thoroughly enjoyable movie, one reviewer commenting "Kinugasa's sublime
>control of color intensifies every emotion in his Academy Award®-winning
>masterpiece, a classic 12th-century tale about a warrior whose love
>dishonors a married woman. The screen is steeped in fiery reds for chaotic
>battle scenes, then blanketed in soothing images of white-kimonoed priests
>beside a calm blue sea. The exquisite compositions and charged performances
>of Kazuo Hasegawa and Machiko Kyo depict a culture dedicated to order, yet
>easily rocked by passion.".
>
>Another reviwer
>http://www.amazon.
> com/Gate-Hell-Teinosuke-Kinugasa/dp/6303073093>
>com/Gate-Hell-Teinosuke-Kinugasa/dp/6303073093 comments:
>
>In 1953, Teinosuke Kinugasa (1896-1982) directed and co-adapted the
>historical play entitled "Jigokumon" (English transliteration of the
>Japanese title), which was written by Kan Kikuchi (1888-1948). The film's
>name (the same as the play) translates into English as "Gate of Hell", and
>was released theatrically in the U.S. in 1954. The story takes place in
>12th-century Japan during the Heian period and at the start of a revolt.
>During the confusion and fear running rampant through the royal palace in
>Kyoto, a lady of the court, Lady Kesa (Machiko Kyo), is rescued by a
>soldier
>named Moritoh (Kazuo Hasegawa, 1908-1984). After the revolt fails, Moritoh
>is told that he can have anything that he wants, and what he wants is Lady
>Kesa to be his wife. He is quickly told, however, that she is already
>married to Wataru Watanabe (Isao Yamagata, 1915-1996). Rather than seek
>something different, Moritoh becomes dangerously obsessed with Lady Kesa.
>Filmed in beautiful & vibrant color (probably one of the first color films
>from Japan), the cinematography in "Gate of Hell" is exquisite. The story
>is
>by no means dated, though it does become somewhat predictable. Still, it is
>both compelling and engaging and the acting is superb, especially Machiko
>Ky. Memorable scenes in the film include the confusion at the royal palace,
>Laky Kesa hiding from traitorous soldiers, Moritoh meeting Lady Kesa and
>her
>aunt after the revolt, Moritoh given the choice of his heart's desire, the
>horse races, Moritoh at the home of Lady Kesa's aunt, and the ending
>scenes.
>The makeup used on Moritoh could have been better.
>
>The film won several awards including an Oscar for Best Costume Design, an
>Honorary Academy Award for Best Foreign Language Film and the prestigious
>Grand Prize at the Cannes Film Festival in France. Overall, I rate "Gate of
>Hell" with 4 out of 5 stars. Hopefully, the film will be fully restored and
>released on DVD one day. I highly recommend the film.
>
>Best regards,
>
>Barry Thomas.
>
>----- Original Message -----
>
>From: "jonathan ellgen" com>
>To:
>yahoogroups.com>
>Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 9:28 AM
>Subject: Re: [samuraihistory]
>
> >I am working on a section of my master's thesis dealing with the Hogen
> >Incident. I was wondering if anyone has any additional sources for
> >information about Uno Chikahara. It isn't vital, but I thought it
>couldn't
> >hurt to ask.
> >
> > Thanks everybody,
> >
> > Jonathan P. Ellgen
>
>
>
>
>
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Good day everyone, I have a brief question regarding the death of tea master Sen no Rikyu. I am sure several of you have an opinion on this topic, and I wanted your input. It is said that Sen no Rikyu committed sokotsu-shi after a command from Hideyoshi. I believe that Hideyoshi lost his temper and later regretted having ordered this, but that is irrelevant perhaps. What I want to know is what the exact reason was for ordering Sen no Ryku's suicide. I read somewhere that Sen no Rikyu refused to offer his daughter as a concubine, but that seems to be a few years earlier. Was there one event, or was this just a build-up of tention after this incident?

Jonathan P. Ellgen


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> Good day everyone, I have a brief question regarding the death of tea

master Sen no Rikyu. I am sure several of you have an opinion on this
topic, and I wanted your input. It is said that

> Sen no Rikyu committed sokotsu-shi after a command from Hideyoshi. I

believe that Hideyoshi lost his temper and later regretted having
ordered this, but that is irrelevant perhaps. What

> I want to know is what the exact reason was for ordering Sen no Ryku's

suicide. I read somewhere that Sen no Rikyu refused to offer his
daughter as a concubine, but that seems to be a

> few years earlier. Was there one event, or was this just a build-up of

tention after this incident?

>
> Jonathan P. Ellgen

IIRC, Hideyoshi's motives are not known for sure. Hideyoshi did a number
of horrific and irrational things during the last decade of his life,
and this appears to fall in to that category. I imagine it would have
been over something quite small or petty, and I've read that he did
indeed regret it afterwards.

-AngusH

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

>
> IIRC, Hideyoshi's motives are not known for sure. Hideyoshi did a number
> of horrific and irrational things during the last decade of his life,
> and this appears to fall in to that category. I imagine it would have
> been over something quite small or petty, and I've read that he did
> indeed regret it afterwards.
>
> -AngusH
>
> _

I think you're right. There are theories, some good ones (although I
can't remember any off the top of my head - maybe Mary Berry's
"Hideyoshi" has some of the theories) but I think it is pretty
unanimous that it is uncertain why he did it.

One thing I remember from my history class is a story saying that Sen
no Rikyu (when he was still alive!) had a statue of him posted over a
gate, I believe it was at Daitokuji. Hideyoshi happened to walk under
such gate, and when he realized that Sen no Rikyu was 'above' him, he
was not pleased.
I am sure this information can be verified, as there are many books
on Hideyoshi and Rikyu. See for example HIDEYOSHI by Berry, or
HIDEYOSHI AND CHA-NO-YU, a small booklet that should talk about what
happened.
Most likely, Hideyoshi-the-megalomaniac was simply jealous. Remember
that back in the day, Rikyu was the equivalent of one of today's
Hollywood star.
Cepo

On Oct 31, 2006, at 1:19 PM, Haynes, A ((Angus)) wrote:

> > Good day everyone, I have a brief question regarding the death of
> tea
> master Sen no Rikyu. I am sure several of you have an opinion on this
> topic, and I wanted your input. It is said that
> > Sen no Rikyu committed sokotsu-shi after a command from Hideyoshi. I
> believe that Hideyoshi lost his temper and later regretted having
> ordered this, but that is irrelevant perhaps. What
> > I want to know is what the exact reason was for ordering Sen no
> Ryku's
> suicide. I read somewhere that Sen no Rikyu refused to offer his
> daughter as a concubine, but that seems to be a
> > few years earlier. Was there one event, or was this just a build-
> up of
> tention after this incident?
> >
> > Jonathan P. Ellgen
>
> IIRC, Hideyoshi's motives are not known for sure. Hideyoshi did a
> number
> of horrific and irrational things during the last decade of his life,
> and this appears to fall in to that category. I imagine it would have
> been over something quite small or petty, and I've read that he did
> indeed regret it afterwards.
>
> -AngusH
>
> __________________________________________________________
>
> This email (including any attachments to it) is confidential,
> legally privileged, subject to copyright and is sent for the
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> or taking any action in reliance on the contents of this
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