the first dynasties

would anybody care about explaining which were the first dynasties in Japan from ancient times. I am really interested since I have to give some tutoring anout it. What is more how did Japan became a feudalism government system ?




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On Jun 3, 2004, at 4:30 AM, Nelson Pleitez wrote:

>
> would  anybody care  about   explaining  which  were  the  first 
> dynasties  in  Japan  from  ancient  times.

If you mean the early "elites, " we don't really know. They were
-PERHAPS- Koreans. But that's only one of the theories.
If you mean the Imperial dynasty, well, theoretically there is only ONE
dynasty. The... Imperial dynasty. They have no name.
Cepo


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Maybe he meant Periods like Jomon, Yayoi etc. ...

Karsten Helmholz

Nelson Pleitez <pleitezbarahona@...> wrote:
would anybody care about explaining which dynasties existed in ancient times ?




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On Jun 3, 2004, at 8:43 AM, Nelson Pleitez wrote:

>
>
> Nelson Pleitez <pleitezbarahona@...> wrote:
> would  anybody care  about  explaining  which  dynasties  existed 
> in  ancient  times ?

What do you mean with "ancient times" ?????
Paleolithic? Neolithic? Jomon? Yayoi? Nara/Heian....??
Please be more specific!!
cepo


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Ok, well the first true dynasty of Japan was the Tokugawa dynasty or
shogun (King). The reason why I say the true dynasty is because the
Tokugawa clan was the first to unite the whole of Japan. Before this
there was may warlords ruling different provinces. Another thing to
bear in mind is that when the Tokugawa shogun united Japan a new era
in Japan began (edo period). Below is a list of the different periods
in Japanese history:

JOMON (10,000 - 300 B.C.) Prehistoric period of tribal/clan
organization.

YAYOI (300 B.C. - A.D. 300) Rice cultivation, metalworking, and the
potter's wheel are introduced from China and Korea. Era named "Yayoi"
after the place in Tokyo where wheel-turned pottery was found.

KOFUN (YAMATO) (300 - 645) Unified state begins with emergence of
powerful clan rulers; Japan establishes close contacts with mainland
Asia.

ASUKA (645 -710) A great wave of reforms called the Taika no Kaishin
(Taika Reforms) aims to strengthen the emperor's power.

NARA (710 - 794) Imperial court builds new capital, modeled upon
Chang-an in China, at Nara. Though emperors are Shinto chiefs, they
patronize Buddhism in the belief that its teachings will bring about
a peaceful society and protect the state.

HEIAN (794-1185) Imperial court moves to Heiankyo (now Kyoto) to
escape domination of Nara's Buddhist establishment. Official contacts
with China stop in 838.

KAMAKURA (185-1333) Military government established in Kamakura by
Minamoto no Yoritomo. Emperor, as figurehead, remains in Kyoto with
the court aristocracy.
MUROMACHI (1333 -1568) Muromachi district of Kyoto becomes base for
Shogun Ashikaga Takauji's new military government.

1467-1568: The 10 year-long Onin no Ran (Onin War)
AZUCHIMOMOYA MA (1568 -1600) Oda Nobunaga starts process of
reunifying Japan after a century of civil war; he is followed by
Toyotomi
Hideyoshi (1536-1598). Foundation of modern Japan is laid.
EDO (TOKUGAWA) (1600 -1868) Japan enters an age of peace and national
isolation.

MEIJI (1868 -1912) The emperor is restored; Japan makes transition to
nation-state.

TAISHO [1912-1926] Japan expands economic base within Asia and the
Pacific.

SHOWA [1926 -1989] Japan experiences World War II and its aftermath,
as well as economic recovery.


And here is a list of the most prominent clans:

Akechi
Amako
(1400-1610)
Gamou
Go-Hôjô
Hosokawa
Imagawa
Maeda
Mori
(1148-1625)
Nagao
Sanada
(1500-1650)
Shimazu
(1280-1640)
Takeda
(1493-1582)
Tokugawa
Ukita

Hope this is helps

Hey
You forgot one. :-) HEISEI (1989 to Present) Emperor Akihito
succeeds Hirohito. :-) Take care. :-)

Tim


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi

I have just watched the 3 Miyamoto Musashi movies and
I was wondering some thing.

In the final one Musashi fight Sasaki at Ganryu
Island.

I know that Musashi's swords are either held in a
private colleciton or some museum, but I was wondering
if Sasaki sword is still know to exist, if so where is
it.

Paul





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On Fri, 04 Jun 2004 04:14:57 -0000, zevlordさん wrote in message <c9ot01+2kn5@...>

>Ok, well the first true dynasty of Japan was the Tokugawa dynasty or
>shogun (King). The reason why I say the true dynasty is because the
>Tokugawa clan was the first to unite the whole of Japan. Before this

I disagree with this answer. Or maybe it's better for me to say that
this is a very simplistic answer to a question that has not really bee
n clarified yet. I don't think that anyone can answer the question unt
il we understand what the original poster means by "early dynasties".

I hope that the original poster does not take this essay and start
using it as the basis for tutoring other people about Japanese
history.

I don't think there is any way to say that the Tokugawa were the first
"true" dynasty.

And, shogun does not mean "King".

>Before this
>there was may warlords ruling different provinces.

Why does this fact mean that anything before Tokugawa does not
qualify as a dynasty? In fact if you look at each of the "provinces"
themselves, the ruling families in each of them tended to be
dynasties - in the sense that the ruling family tended to hold control
across generations. Further those same warlord families continued to
rule the provinces even during the Tokugawa era.

>Another thing to
>bear in mind is that when the Tokugawa shogun united Japan a new era
>in Japan began (edo period). Below is a list of the different periods
>in Japanese history:

The naming of eras does not provide a measuring stick for what is
and what is not a dynasty. Even if it did, your own list shows two
other eras, Kamakura and Muromachi, that had their own name and that
were ruled by different shogun families.

This timeline is handy as a quick reference point. But of course it
oversimplifies and makes too many assumptions to be used as a basis
for . Did you get it from this site?
http://www.askasia.org/frclasrm/readings/t000013.htm



--
Jay Kelly
oyakata@...

Hi Paul,
Musashis swords do not exist anymore. The ones displayed in the museum in
Kumamoto are replicas that are said to be well maid but not authentic. The
only thing that survived was a bokken that is supposed to handed down
through the generations.
(Information accqired through Hyakutake Colins posts on e-budo)

I have no information about Sasaki Kojiros sword. I suggest you email Colin
about that. He should be the one to know it.

Karsten Helmholz

Hi

Please can you forward the names of these movies.

Thank you
Rivaaj

-----Original Message-----
From: Richardson Paul [mailto:umaryu@...]
Sent: 04 June 2004 11:40 AM
To: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [samuraihistory] Kohiro Sasaki

Hi

I have just watched the 3 Miyamoto Musashi movies and
I was wondering some thing.

In the final one Musashi fight Sasaki at Ganryu
Island.

I know that Musashi's swords are either held in a
private colleciton or some museum, but I was wondering
if Sasaki sword is still know to exist, if so where is
it.

Paul





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I think you also should explain what do you mean for dynasties. If we want to talk about Tenno's family through the ages..well only one!Japanese monarchy is famous to remain the same through 2000 years.
This is what I know...
Daniele




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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On Jun 4, 2004, at 9:03 AM, Daniele Frison wrote:

> I think you also should explain what do you mean for dynasties. If we
> want to talk about Tenno's family through the ages..well only
> one!Japanese monarchy is famous to remain the same through 2000 years.

Well, this is "how the story goes." The evidence starts around the
600s, so its about 1500 years.
Historically, I believe the longest ruling dynasty is the Persian line,
that went from Cyrus (6th c. BCE) until 1979.
2508 years!!
cepo

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

THis is a good news for me..
thanks Mr. Polenghi!
Daniele
Cesare Polenghi <cepo@...> wrote:

On Jun 4, 2004, at 9:03 AM, Daniele Frison wrote:

> I think you also should explain what do you mean for dynasties. If we
> want to talk about Tenno's family through the ages..well only
> one!Japanese monarchy is famous to remain the same through 2000 years.

Well, this is "how the story goes." The evidence starts around the
600s, so its about 1500 years.
Historically, I believe the longest ruling dynasty is the Persian line,
that went from Cyrus (6th c. BCE) until 1979.
2508 years!!
cepo

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Hello everyone.
I'm preparing my degree thesis and (obviously would say my friends) I choosed to do a research about Bakumatsu.
Now, I'm writing to you for a specific thing and I am sure this is the only place where I could find an help! In a manga (Rurouni Kenshin to be exact) translated in italian, unfortunately, I found a poem; I don't know if it is a haiku or it belongs to other style of poetry or if it isa novel as well, but it is about the arrive of the Black Ship, about the Commodore Perry.
I would like to know if someone knows it or tell me where I could find the japanese version.
I translated it into english, but I don't know how much it is similar to the original. I don't know if this could help anyway.
"the ocean's sleep stopped
when the monster arrived
after four toasts,
in the night they didn' sleep"
Your help would be VERY appreciate.
Thanks anyway
Daniele



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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Daniele, I am quite sure I have read that poem in English. So, it
should be somewhere, in a book or in a journal. Have you tried on
amazon.com? Now they list books according to their content as well
(word by word). Of course you need to trust your translation, but
perhaps... good luck.
By the way, where are you studying?
Ciao
cepo

On Jun 5, 2004, at 2:05 AM, Daniele Frison wrote:

> Hello everyone.
> I'm preparing my degree thesis and (obviously would say my friends) I
> choosed to do a research about Bakumatsu.
> Now, I'm writing to you for a specific thing and I am sure this is
> the only place where I could find an help! In a manga (Rurouni Kenshin
> to be exact) translated in italian, unfortunately, I found a poem; I
> don't know if it is a haiku or it belongs to other style of poetry or
> if it� isa novel as well, but it is about the arrive of the Black
> Ship, about the Commodore Perry.
> I would like to know if someone knows it or tell me where I could
> find the japanese version.
> I translated it into english, but I don't know how much it is similar
> to the original. I don't know if this could help anyway.
> "the ocean's sleep stopped
> when the monster arrived
> after four toasts,
> in the night they didn' sleep"
> Your help would be VERY appreciate.
> Thanks anyway
> Daniele
>
>
> ����� �����
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>
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On Sat, 5 Jun 2004 05:05:28 -0700 (PDT), Daniele Frisonさん wrote in message <20040605120528.34668.qmail@...>

>I translated it into english, but I don't know how much it is similar to the
>original. I don't know if this could help anyway.
>"the ocean's sleep stopped
>when the monster arrived
>after four toasts,
>in the night they didn' sleep"
>Your help would be VERY appreciate.

Bakumatsu is definitely not my territory, but the poem is famous. It's
not exactly how it has been passed onto you in Italian. The
poem goes:

泰平の眠りを覚ます上喜撰
たった４杯で夜も眠れず

It is a style called "狂歌", kyouka.

Like most kyouka it's very hard to translate because it involves
puns. But it says:

"Joukisen - wakes them up from their peaceful sleep
With just four cups they cannot sleep at night".

All kinds of action in here. :) This "peaceful" 泰平 sleep is a pun
for "Pacific" 太平 sleep - in other words not paying attention to what
is going on across the ocean. That is probably the meaning of the
pun that the Japanese-Italian translator chose to use in his
translation.

Joukisen is a kind of tea. So the apparent meaning of the poem is
that the person who drinks 4 cups of tea is not able to sleep at
night.

The trick is that "joukisen" 上喜撰 also is the pronunciation of the
word "steamship" 蒸気船　and 4 "cups" is interpreted as "4 ships".

So the hidden meaning is "4 steam ships wake them up from their
Pacific sleep. Now they cannot sleep at night".

Of course as you know of the 4 ships only 2 of them were steamships
- but that's just a minor detail. :)

--
Jay Kelly
oyakata@...

I don't know what it says. I only speak French and japanese (and of course English). Here is a really good essay you would like:


ONE DAY THE SUN WILL RISE
Many have screamed the truth to the heavens, many will continue to do so to the wind; but few ears are really willing to listen. Can it be that our human nature prevents us from "hearing" what our masters are telling us? Can it be that humanity is asleep, choked with false values, idols or ideals? Why do most people roam searching, consciously or unconsciously, for something or someone to follow? Are we facing our own drowsiness when we search to be identified, noticed and become a part of something?

Many people have asked themselves: Who am I? Where am I going? Why am I here in this world? Questions that surely have troubled us, but the real problem is not the question, rather the answer. How many of us have found it? Sadder still, how many of us haven't found it? Even sadder still, how many of us, once we've made the question haven't even taken the time to think about it? It seems easier to follow the "normal" course of things, be born, live and die without knowing why and what for.

Have we ever stopped in our lives to "see" and "listen"? Have we stopped the world and analysed if we are on the right road? And do we even know any other road different from egoism, vanity, violence and consumism?

Many will stick to the different forms of religion and creeds while searching for something more human; others will follow different forms of cultural, bodily and spiritual expressions and in this search (if it exists) how will we know if we are on the right track? Let us listen to our inner being, listen and interpret our internal signals and intuition.

If you are reading these reflexions, you are related to Karate in some way, if so, have you ever stopped to think if you are really practicing Karate? Before continuing, ask yourself: what do I understand by Karate? Most probably, and I understand you, it may be exactly the contrary of what it really is. Mass media have created the general concept people have of Karate, violence, egoism, individualism and vanity are concepts that are manipulated, inbuilt and hightened to "sell" it in our society.

We are used to competing in every aspect of our lives, then why not compete in Karate? Is this what our Masters, the founders of the art, wanted for us, for the human society? What would Master Funakoshi and Master Egami think about the evolution the Martial Art has taken? Do you really think the attributes I just mentioned were the goals of karate evolution the masters defined?

If you practice competition (and I will not call it Karate), I invite you to strongly reflect on these words, because the real "DO" is not a road to violence, actually its the exact contrary, it's the road to love. Yes, Karate-do is the road of love (way of love), the art transformed into love, the road of personal development based on love, love of yourself, love of your training partner, love of your Dojo, love of your environment, love of nature, love of teaching, love of spirituality. Love, respect, loyalty, partnership, detachment are a few of the concepts our masters have tried to give us through their "art" called KARATE. If we accept that Karate is love, spirituality, a connection with the Universe, with the vital energy, with Ki; what then is competition? I will leave the question open, but once again I ask: What sense is there in winning over another person? Is there any pleasure in hurting a training partner? What do I want to prove by breaking a rib? Is it so important to
feel you are a "winner", but winner of what? Is it justifiable to hurt or harm someone else to have a medal hanging on the wall? Because you were the best... best in what? of what? for what? I leave the questions open and each one must deeply reflect and find his/her own answers, answers based on the personal study within this beautiful art called Karate, that never was, and never will be, a method to harm others, nor a method to heighten or feed egos, negative feelings or vanities.

Let's not waste our time, let's wake up and jump right in the adventure of personal development, the search of the real I. And how far will we go? It all depends on how deep we are willing to go.

Later,

Sam








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Would just like to apologize for my stupid mistake that I made on my
previous post and would like to thank Oyakata for pointing this out
to me. Shogun does not mean "King". A shogun is a warlord or governor
of a province. This is what happens when you quickly reply to a post
at work (you make silly mistakes). Also to answer Oyakata question on
the website, I believe that was one of the websites I got my
information from.

--- zevlord <LordZev@...> wrote:
Shogun does not mean "King". A shogun is a

> warlord or governor
> of a province. This is what happens when you quickly
> reply to a post
> at work (you make silly mistakes).

Sorry to correct you again, but shogun does *not* mean
warlord, or governor of a province. It's short for
"sei-i tai shogun", and means, loosely translated,
"barbarian subduing general in chief" or some
approximation. It was the title granted to the
military dictator of the country, not a province, by
the Emperor, ostensibly to rule in the Emperor's name.
Three families held the title--first the Minamoto,
then the Ashikaga (related to the Minamoto), then the
Tokugawa (supposedly related, though it's been
questioned). Most sources will tell you that direct
relation to the Minamoto family was required to be
granted the title, but that's also been questioned.

"Shogun" by itself basically means "general", or
"field marshal". "Taisho" is much more common for
general, though.

"Daimyo", literally meaning "big name", is the word
you are thinking of when you think "warlord"--that's
about the most direct translation. However, it didn't
necessarily have a provincial designation. You could
be "daimyo" of a province, you could be "daimyo" of
many provinces, or of part of a province. Governor is
often the translation for the title "kami", and in the
Heian period did mean actual appointment as a
governor, for the most part. In the 1500's, it was
largely a name only title--you could be "Bingo no
kami" (Governor of Bingo) without ever having set foot
in the province of Bingo, and having nothing to do
with the administration of it.




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On Mon, 7 Jun 2004 20:49:24 -0700 (PDT), Nate Ledbetterさん wrote in message <20040608034924.28328.qmail@...>

>approximation. It was the title granted to the
>military dictator of the country, not a province, by
>the Emperor, ostensibly to rule in the Emperor's name.

Interestingly the title Sei-i-tai-Shogun actually goes back even
further than the Minamoto. For a while in the Heian period, it was the
title - or rather a sort of temporary title - of people who were
literally assigned to quell the northeastern part of Japan. It was not
a life-long position and it was granted and rescinded a few times
before the Kamakura "shogunate" as we think of it today.

The first was TaJiHi-no-AgataMori in 720. The most famous of these
early shogun was probably Saka-no-ue no Tamura Maro in 797.

There were other, similar military "assignments" that came with
temporary titles during this Heian period.

>questioned). Most sources will tell you that direct
>relation to the Minamoto family was required to be
>granted the title, but that's also been questioned.

Personally I don't believe that there was a specific "rule" that the
shogun had to be from the Minamoto line, or Genji. It was more like
an accepted practice. I talk a little about the relationship between
the Minamoto and the Taira families at the "Family Tree" section of my
website.

>many provinces, or of part of a province. Governor is
>often the translation for the title "kami", and in the
>Heian period did mean actual appointment as a
>governor, for the most part. In the 1500's, it was
>largely a name only title--you could be "Bingo no
>kami" (Governor of Bingo) without ever having set foot
>in the province of Bingo, and having nothing to do
>with the administration of it.

To take this a little further: These titles were relics from the
ritsuryo system which had died out several hundreds of years
earlier. One of my pet projects right now is to study the ritsuryo
system and to follow that through the centuries to try and figure
out why these titles remained so important that they were kept for
so long, without any connection to reality.

Finally as you might already know, Bingo-no-kami was actually one of
the titles of Nobunaga's father, Nobuhide. :)

--
Jay Kelly
oyakata@...

--- Oyakata <oyakata@...> wrote:

>
> Interestingly the title Sei-i-tai-Shogun actually
> goes back even
> further than the Minamoto. For a while in the Heian
> period, it was the
> title - or rather a sort of temporary title - of
> people who were
> literally assigned to quell the northeastern part of
> Japan. It was not
> a life-long position and it was granted and
> rescinded a few times
> before the Kamakura "shogunate" as we think of it
> today.

Yeah, I know, but I was going with the "simple answer
is better" theory for the moment. To explain it in its
entirety in order to disavow the notion that it was a
provincial lord seemed like it might be a bit much.

> Personally I don't believe that there was a specific
> "rule" that the
> shogun had to be from the Minamoto line, or Genji.
> It was more like
> an accepted practice. I talk a little about the
> relationship between
> the Minamoto and the Taira families at the "Family
> Tree" section of my
> website.

Agree--especially since there is evidence in letters
that some court nobles extended an offer to Nobunaga
to secure the position for him. Being as he claimed
Taira descent and not Minamoto, that would seem to put
the nix on that.

> Finally as you might already know, Bingo-no-kami was
> actually one of
> the titles of Nobunaga's father, Nobuhide. :)

I did NOT know that...interesting.




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I stand corrected once again. Guess I need to refresh myself on
Japanese history, as I seem to be getting things wrong. Am from
Australia and have limited resources on Japanese history. So sorry
once again for my stuff ups. Looking at the meaning for both though I
thought Warlord was a better term for Shogun as a:
Barbarian –is "primitive or uncivilised
1. a crude uncouth ill-bred person lacking culture or refinement
Companied to:
War-lord – means armed fighting between countries
1. supreme military leader exercising civil power in a region
especially one accountable to nobody when the central government is
weak

No need to apologize, that's what this board is for,
to provide information. Now, if you went arguing with
all of us, claiming the latest ninja turtle anime to
be your credible source, we might have issues :).

Nate

--- zevlord <LordZev@...> wrote:

> I stand corrected once again. Guess I need to
> refresh myself on
> Japanese history, as I seem to be getting things
> wrong. Am from
> Australia and have limited resources on Japanese
> history. So sorry
> once again for my stuff ups. Looking at the meaning
> for both though I
> thought Warlord was a better term for Shogun as a:
> Barbarian �is "primitive or uncivilised
> 1. a crude uncouth ill-bred person lacking culture
> or refinement
> Companied to:
> War-lord � means armed fighting between countries
> 1. supreme military leader exercising civil power in
> a region
> especially one accountable to nobody when the
> central government is
> weak
>
>
>

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--- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, Nate Ledbetter
wrote:

> No need to apologize, that's what this board is for,
> to provide information. Now, if you went arguing with
> all of us, claiming the latest ninja turtle anime to
> be your credible source, we might have issues :).
>
> Nate

he he :)
Ninja turtle are cool but I agree not the best resource material

Neither so are Playstation 2 games (my periodic references to Onimusha,
anyone?!). But it is fun to learn the history behind the game. :-)

L8r
T


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On Jun 8, 2004, at 7:07 PM, Eponymous13@... wrote:

> Neither so are Playstation 2 games (my periodic references to Onimusha,
> anyone?!).  But it is fun to learn the history behind the game.  :-)
>
> L8r
> T

Does anybody knows of any good Japanese-history-related videogame for
the GameCube? :oD
cepo


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sorry, buddy. Can't help ya there. :-) My next system may be the X-box so
I can play Genma Onimusha: Warlords, the one version I haven't played yet.
Though the GameCube sounds interesting. :-)

Tim


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On Jun 8, 2004, at 7:47 PM, Eponymous13@... wrote:

> Sorry, buddy.  Can't help ya there.  :-)  My next system may be the
> X-box so
> I can play Genma Onimusha: Warlords, the one version I haven't played
> yet. 
> Though the GameCube sounds interesting.  :-)
>
> Tim

It's my son's: he's a Pokemon mainiac, so he went for Nintendo.... :o(
cepo


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I think you're pretty much out of luck with a
gamecube. Most of their games are the "Pokemon"
crowd...ages 5-13. They realized they couldn't compete
with Xbox and PS2, so went for a different market.

My advice, having played both systems (and owning
neither, so I'm not biased) is to a. buy an XBOX if
you want better graphics, b. buy a PS2 if you want
better games, c. wait for the new PSX to come out in
Japan, or d. check what's available for Gamecube when
you get to Japan this summer. They might have some
better releases in Japan than in the US--that's where
I bought my best PS1 games, that I wish I still had
the player for. Oh well.

One warning on d., I had to get a chip put into my
american player to play asian games--don't know if
Gamecube is the same. It was like the regional coding
for DVD's.
--- Cesare Polenghi <cepo@...> wrote:

> On Jun 8, 2004, at 7:47 PM, Eponymous13@...
> wrote:
>
> > Sorry, buddy.� Can't help ya there.� :-)� My next
> system may be the
> > X-box so
> > I can play Genma Onimusha: Warlords, the one
> version I haven't played
> > yet.�
> > Though the GameCube sounds interesting.� :-)
> >
> > Tim
>
> It's my son's: he's a Pokemon mainiac, so he went
> for Nintendo.... :o(
> cepo
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been
> removed]
>
>

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Have you ever played Shogun Total War????(it doesn't matter on which platform!)




Nate Ledbetter <ltdomer98@...> wrote:I think you're pretty much out of luck with a
gamecube. Most of their games are the "Pokemon"
crowd...ages 5-13. They realized they couldn't compete
with Xbox and PS2, so went for a different market.

My advice, having played both systems (and owning
neither, so I'm not biased) is to a. buy an XBOX if
you want better graphics, b. buy a PS2 if you want
better games, c. wait for the new PSX to come out in
Japan, or d. check what's available for Gamecube when
you get to Japan this summer. They might have some
better releases in Japan than in the US--that's where
I bought my best PS1 games, that I wish I still had
the player for. Oh well.

One warning on d., I had to get a chip put into my
american player to play asian games--don't know if
Gamecube is the same. It was like the regional coding
for DVD's.
--- Cesare Polenghi wrote:

> On Jun 8, 2004, at 7:47 PM, Eponymous13@...
> wrote:
>
> > Sorry, buddy. Can't help ya there. :-) My next
> system may be the
> > X-box so
> > I can play Genma Onimusha: Warlords, the one
> version I haven't played
> > yet.
> > Though the GameCube sounds interesting. :-)
> >
> > Tim
>
> It's my son's: he's a Pokemon mainiac, so he went
> for Nintendo.... :o(
> cepo
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been
> removed]
>
>

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Its the bomb! :-)

Edward Alexander wrote:

> Have you ever played Shogun Total War????(it doesn't matter on which
> platform!)
>
>
>
>
> Nate Ledbetter <ltdomer98@...> wrote:I think you're pretty much
> out of luck with a
> gamecube. Most of their games are the "Pokemon"
> crowd...ages 5-13. They realized they couldn't compete
> with Xbox and PS2, so went for a different market.
>
> My advice, having played both systems (and owning
> neither, so I'm not biased) is to a. buy an XBOX if
> you want better graphics, b. buy a PS2 if you want
> better games, c. wait for the new PSX to come out in
> Japan, or d. check what's available for Gamecube when
> you get to Japan this summer. They might have some
> better releases in Japan than in the US--that's where
> I bought my best PS1 games, that I wish I still had
> the player for. Oh well.
>
> One warning on d., I had to get a chip put into my
> american player to play asian games--don't know if
> Gamecube is the same. It was like the regional coding
> for DVD's.
> --- Cesare Polenghi wrote:
> > On Jun 8, 2004, at 7:47 PM, Eponymous13@...
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Sorry, buddy. Can't help ya there. :-) My next
> > system may be the
> > > X-box so
> > > I can play Genma Onimusha: Warlords, the one
> > version I haven't played
> > > yet.
> > > Though the GameCube sounds interesting. :-)
> > >
> > > Tim
> >
> > It's my son's: he's a Pokemon mainiac, so he went
> > for Nintendo.... :o(
> > cepo
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been
> > removed]
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
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>
>
> ---
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> ---
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>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> HIP-HOP Man!!!
>
>
> ---------------------------------
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>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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>
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- Edward Alexander <edyhiphop@...> wrote:

> Have you ever played Shogun Total War????(it doesn't
> matter on which platform!)

It's only on one platform, the computer. The
discussion was about videogame players. It's a great
game, but the newer editions of Kessen and Nobunaga's
Ambition available here in Japan are much better.




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I know that!!!!!!!!!!!!!What's your favourite clan???????Mine is Uesugi.

Daniel & Annabelle <kenshin@...> wrote:Its the bomb! :-)

Edward Alexander wrote:

> Have you ever played Shogun Total War????(it doesn't matter on which
> platform!)
>
>
>
>
> Nate Ledbetter <ltdomer98@...> wrote:I think you're pretty much
> out of luck with a
> gamecube. Most of their games are the "Pokemon"
> crowd...ages 5-13. They realized they couldn't compete
> with Xbox and PS2, so went for a different market.
>
> My advice, having played both systems (and owning
> neither, so I'm not biased) is to a. buy an XBOX if
> you want better graphics, b. buy a PS2 if you want
> better games, c. wait for the new PSX to come out in
> Japan, or d. check what's available for Gamecube when
> you get to Japan this summer. They might have some
> better releases in Japan than in the US--that's where
> I bought my best PS1 games, that I wish I still had
> the player for. Oh well.
>
> One warning on d., I had to get a chip put into my
> american player to play asian games--don't know if
> Gamecube is the same. It was like the regional coding
> for DVD's.
> --- Cesare Polenghi wrote:
> > On Jun 8, 2004, at 7:47 PM, Eponymous13@...
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Sorry, buddy. Can't help ya there. :-) My next
> > system may be the
> > > X-box so
> > > I can play Genma Onimusha: Warlords, the one
> > version I haven't played
> > > yet.
> > > Though the GameCube sounds interesting. :-)
> > >
> > > Tim
> >
> > It's my son's: he's a Pokemon mainiac, so he went
> > for Nintendo.... :o(
> > cepo
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been
> > removed]
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Friends. Fun. Try the all-new Yahoo! Messenger.
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>
>
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> ---
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>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> HIP-HOP Man!!!
>
>
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> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Cesare Polenghi <cepo@...> wrote:On Jun 3, 2004, at 8:43 AM, Nelson Pleitez wrote:

>
>
> Nelson Pleitez <pleitezbarahona@...> wrote:
> would anybody care about explaining which dynasties existed
> in ancient times ?

What do you mean with "ancient times" ?????
Paleolithic? Neolithic? Jomon? Yayoi? Nara/Heian....??
Please be more specific!!
cepo

I mean about 202 A. D. ! I understand there were four dynasties, and I want to know the major achievement they had as dynasties and how they modified, If they did so, the social customs.!



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On Jun 16, 2004, at 6:37 AM, Nelson Pleitez wrote:

>
> I mean about  202  A. D. !  I  understand  there  were  four 
> dynasties, and  I want  to know  the  major  achievement  they  had 
> as  dynasties  and  how  they  modified,  If  they  did  so, the 
> social  customs.!

I am not an expert of this old period, but I doubt we have ANY evidence
of 4 dynasties in 202AD. The only documents of this period are the
Chinese, and they briefly describe society, but give no names.
cepo


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

The Chinese records of the third century CE, such as those of the Wei Dynasty, use names for the various groupings that their envoys were in contact with, although these names, and their groups, are particularly difficult to place geographically. The Wei envoys whom visited Japan did so between 220 and 265, with envoys from 'Japan' heading to present-day Korea between 238 and 247. The Wei records list thirty "countries" on the Japanese archipelago, primarily in central Honshu and Kyushu, although "dynasties" may be a term unsuited to these largely tribal confederations of the latter Yayoi period, rather than the later, progressively centralised nation-state under the leading tribe (or "country" from the Chinese records), the Yamato.
M.Lorimer

Cesare Polenghi <cepo@...> wrote:

On Jun 16, 2004, at 6:37 AM, Nelson Pleitez wrote:

>
> I mean about 202 A. D. ! I understand there were four
> dynasties, and I want to know the major achievement they had
> as dynasties and how they modified, If they did so, the
> social customs.!

I am not an expert of this old period, but I doubt we have ANY evidence
of 4 dynasties in 202AD. The only documents of this period are the
Chinese, and they briefly describe society, but give no names.
cepo


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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--- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, Cesare Polenghi
wrote:

>
> I am not an expert of this old period, but I doubt we have ANY

evidence

> of 4 dynasties in 202AD. The only documents of this period are the
> Chinese, and they briefly describe society, but give no names.
> cepo

Hi, I'm new to this group (although some of you might know me from
the Samurai Archives message board.

I don't know if I've understood the question fully, but if we're talking
about ancient Japan, 202AD would be roughly during the time of the
Empress Jingo's (Jingo Kogo) regency, or around 200 years before the
start of the Yamato period. She supposedly invaded Korea around
200AD (I have no idea if this date is myth or reality), although I've also
seen 366AD cited as a date for her invasion of Silla, and 200AD cited as
the date around which Himiko/Pimiko ruled. I have absolutely no idea
which of these two sets of dates is correct though.

Shane.

that narrows it down to about a million samurai, please excuse the sarcasm, i agree a great deed would help





Tom Hatfield

"In all forms of stratagy, it is necessary to maintain the combat stance in everyday life, and to make your everyday stance your combat stance."

-Miyamoto Musashi, The Book of Five Rings,

The Water Book

oneundeadlord@...








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On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 11:37:44 -0500 (CDT), Nelson Pleitezさん wrote in message <20040616163744.90085.qmail@...>

>I mean about 202 A. D. ! I understand there were four dynasties, and
>I want to know the major achievement they had as dynasties and how
>they modified, If they did so, the social customs.!

Nelson,
You're getting lots of replies but it's still very hard for me to
understand exactly what you mean.

Can you please tell us what you mean by the word "dynasty"? Also,
where did you come to the understanding that there were four of
these "dynasties" in Japan in 202AD?

I think if we can get a little bit more perspective from your side,
we can all help with exactly the kind of information you are
looking for.

--
Jay Kelly
oyakata@...

hiaku are syallable based poems. so traslating it into english probably doesnt help at all. the syllables need to be counted when it is said in japanese


Daniele Frison <eriel666@...> wrote: Hello everyone.
I'm preparing my degree thesis and (obviously would say my friends) I choosed to do a research about Bakumatsu.
Now, I'm writing to you for a specific thing and I am sure this is the only place where I could find an help! In a manga (Rurouni Kenshin to be exact) translated in italian, unfortunately, I found a poem; I don't know if it is a haiku or it belongs to other style of poetry or if it isa novel as well, but it is about the arrive of the Black Ship, about the Commodore Perry.
I would like to know if someone knows it or tell me where I could find the japanese version.
I translated it into english, but I don't know how much it is similar to the original. I don't know if this could help anyway.
"the ocean's sleep stopped
when the monster arrived
after four toasts,
in the night they didn' sleep"
Your help would be VERY appreciate.
Thanks anyway
Daniele



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On Tue, 13 Jul 2004 11:46:11 -0700 (PDT), Shawn Eisenzimmerさん wrote:

>hiaku are syallable based poems.

The song in question is not a haiku. It's a kyou-ka. I'm not quite
sure what you mean by syllable-based poems, but I guess you mean that
it has a specific number of syllables. That is true for kyou-ka as
well as for haiku..Kyou-ka go in the same structure as tan-ka, and
have the misohito-moji 三十一文字 structure (57577)

--
Jay Kelly
oyakata@...