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#3921 [2004-03-21 12:19:45]

most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by cutetweety14

who do you think the most famous samurai is?
ANSWER ASAP!!!!!!!!!

[Next #3922]

#3922 [2004-03-21 13:44:37]

Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by goodfella26426

With out a doubt, Miyamoto Musashi.. I dont know of anyone who hasnt at least heard of "Book of 5 Rings." It is used in soo many campuses its not funny...



--

--------- Original Message ---------
DATE: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 19:19:45
From: "cutetweety14" <cutetweety14@...>
To: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
Cc:

who do you think the most famous samurai is?
ANSWER ASAP!!!!!!!!!



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[Previous #3921] [Next #3923]

#3923 [2004-03-21 16:04:13]

Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by ltdomer98

--- cutetweety14 <cutetweety14@...> wrote:
> who do you think the most famous samurai is?
> ANSWER ASAP!!!!!!!!!
>

What on EARTH are you asking? Who's the most
well-known samurai outside of Japan? When you think
"samurai", who's name first comes to mind? This is
about as GENERAL as you could possibly make a
question. And don't put "ANSWER ASAP"--it makes me
think you're doing this for a report or something for
your 7th grade world history class, and don't want to
bother to do any research yourself, but have to have
the paper turned in tomorrow.

To answer the way I rephrased the question, I'd say
for the first, it's probably Miyamoto Musashi,
unfortunately. For the second, undoubtedly I think of
Oda Nobunaga.

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[Previous #3922] [Next #3924]

#3924 [2004-03-21 15:40:56]

Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by kinglink89

Josh Wilson <lordwilson@...> wrote:With out a doubt, Miyamoto Musashi.. I dont know of anyone who hasnt at least heard of "Book of 5 Rings." It is used in soo many campuses its not funny...

no,no,no,no,no,no. Usuigi Kenshin is ( I think ) the best in all history.

--

--------- Original Message ---------
DATE: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 19:19:45
From: "cutetweety14" <cutetweety14@...>
To: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
Cc:

who do you think the most famous samurai is?
ANSWER ASAP!!!!!!!!!



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[Previous #3923] [Next #3925]

#3925 [2004-03-21 16:10:56]

Re: most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by kitsuno

--- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, travis durrant
wrote:
>
>
> Josh Wilson wrote:With out a doubt, Miyamoto
Musashi.. I dont know of anyone who hasnt at least heard of "Book of
5 Rings." It is used in soo many campuses its not funny...
>
> no,no,no,no,no,no. Usuigi Kenshin is ( I think ) the best in all
history.


If the question is "best known", then I would go with Musashi, at
least in the USA. No one knows who Uesugi Kenshin is here...

[Previous #3924] [Next #3926]

#3926 [2004-03-21 16:27:11]

Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by sengokudaimyo

travis durrant wrote:
>
> Josh Wilson <lordwilson@...> wrote:With out a doubt, Miyamoto Musashi.. I dont know of anyone who hasnt at least heard of "Book of 5 Rings." It is used in soo many campuses its not funny...
>
> no,no,no,no,no,no. Usuigi Kenshin is ( I think ) the best in all history.

The question wasn't "best" -- it was "most famous."

And, sadly, Musashi is probably the one.


Tony

[Previous #3925] [Next #3927]

#3927 [2004-03-21 16:41:40]

Re: [samuraihistory] Re: most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by ltdomer98

--- Kitsuno <samurai-listowner@...>
wrote:

>
>
> If the question is "best known", then I would go
> with Musashi, at
> least in the USA. No one knows who Uesugi Kenshin
> is here...

And more is the pity...

If he had written a best selling business tactics
book, we'd know him, wouldn't we?

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[Previous #3926] [Next #3928]

#3928 [2004-03-21 18:12:41]

was musashi a samurai? were " most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP"

by tbsorrentino

Was Musashi a 'samurai'? Was he a retainer for a daimyo or other lord? I
have never come across any references about Musashi being enthralled by a
retainer bound, which is an essencial part of the definition of ?samurai?
from a historical point of view. Alack, even most fiction on him thrives on
his alleged independent nature and free spirit.

Could you kindly point me some resources on a contingent retainership by M.
Musashi?

Cheers,

Thiago
-----Mensagem original-----
De: Anthony J. Bryant [mailto:ajbryant@...]
Enviada em: domingo, 21 de marco de 2004 20:27
Para: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
Assunto: Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP


travis durrant wrote:
>
> Josh Wilson <lordwilson@...> wrote:With out a doubt, Miyamoto
Musashi.. I dont know of anyone who hasnt at least heard of "Book of 5
Rings." It is used in soo many campuses its not funny...
>
> no,no,no,no,no,no. Usuigi Kenshin is ( I think ) the best in all
history.

The question wasn't "best" -- it was "most famous."

And, sadly, Musashi is probably the one.


Tony



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[Previous #3927] [Next #3929]

#3929 [2004-03-21 17:26:11]

Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by Leonardo Lessa

Sorry about my newbie question because I have been studying about japanese
history recently
but, what do you all mean by "sadly" Musashi is the most famous?

----- Original Message -----
From: "Anthony J. Bryant" <ajbryant@...>
To: <samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 8:27 PM
Subject: Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP


> travis durrant wrote:
> >
> > Josh Wilson <lordwilson@...> wrote:With out a doubt, Miyamoto
Musashi.. I dont know of anyone who hasnt at least heard of "Book of 5
Rings." It is used in soo many campuses its not funny...
> >
> > no,no,no,no,no,no. Usuigi Kenshin is ( I think ) the best in all
history.
>
> The question wasn't "best" -- it was "most famous."
>
> And, sadly, Musashi is probably the one.
>
>
> Tony
>
>
>
> ---
> Samurai Archives: http://www.samurai-archives.com
> Samurai Archives store: http://www.cafeshops.com/samuraiarchives
> ---
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

[Previous #3928] [Next #3931]

#3931 [2004-03-21 21:05:42]

Re: [samuraihistory] was musashi a samurai? were " most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP"

by ltdomer98

--- Thiago Buschinelli Sorrentino
<tsorrentino@...> wrote:
>
> Was Musashi a 'samurai'? Was he a retainer for a
> daimyo or other lord? I
> have never come across any references about Musashi
> being enthralled by a
> retainer bound, which is an essencial part of the
> definition of ?samurai?
> from a historical point of view.

Not necessarily. Being born into the class was an
essential part of being a samurai--you didn't
necessarily have to "serve" someone, per se, though we
all think of it as such. For instance--the highest
member of the samurai class, the daimyo, didn't
"SERVE" anyone else, really--only himself. Is he by
definition, not a samurai? Hardly.

While I'm not a Musashi fan, he was born into the
class, as I recall, making him by definition a
samurai.

Nate

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[Previous #3929] [Next #3934]

#3934 [2004-03-21 21:19:16]

Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by sengokudaimyo

Leonardo Lessa wrote:

> but, what do you all mean by "sadly" Musashi is the most famous?

Basically that there are many, many samurai who should be famous for their
achievements, but all the samuraifanboys are in love with Musashi because he
wrote a book.


Tony

[Previous #3931] [Next #3936]

#3936 [2004-03-21 21:27:37]

Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by ltdomer98

--- "Anthony J. Bryant" <ajbryant@...> wrote:
> Leonardo Lessa wrote:
>
> > but, what do you all mean by "sadly" Musashi is
> the most famous?
>
> Basically that there are many, many samurai who
> should be famous for their
> achievements, but all the samuraifanboys are in love
> with Musashi because he
> wrote a book.
>
>
> Tony

Oh come on, he's so cool! I used his business strategy
to build my dot.com!

And here I am, in the Army now....lol

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[Previous #3934] [Next #3938]

#3938 [2004-03-21 21:29:00]

Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by holydemon13

Hey.
At the risk of being branded heretical, I personally wouldn't have
even thought of Musashi. To me "Musashi" is the first set of sounds of a name of
a sumo heya (Musashigawa) and part of the shikona of the last yokozuna to
retire (Musashimaru), and that was the only thing I associated it with.
To me, my top two choices (although they aren't necessarily my
favourites) would be 1. Hideyoshi and 2. Nobunaga. Uesugi Kenshin, Takeda Shingen,
Akechi Mitsuhide and Tokugawa Ieyasu would round out my top six, followed
closely by Shibata Katsuie and (maybe) Mori Motonari and Saito Dosan, but those two
are stretches.
And thanx for the business reading recommendation. I'll have to dig
up the copy I typed out in college. (And yes, I actually typed out Art of War
-- word for blasted word -- as typing practice my freshman year for the hell
of it.) :-)
Take care, y'all. :-)

L8r
Tim


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Previous #3936] [Next #3940]

#3940 [2004-03-21 21:36:08]

Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by ltdomer98

--- Eponymous13@... wrote:
> At the risk of being branded heretical, I
> personally wouldn't have
> even thought of Musashi.

To me, my top two choices (although they
> aren't necessarily my
> favourites) would be 1. Hideyoshi and 2. Nobunaga.
> Uesugi Kenshin, Takeda Shingen,
> Akechi Mitsuhide and Tokugawa Ieyasu would round out
> my top six, followed
> closely by Shibata Katsuie and (maybe) Mori Motonari
> and Saito Dosan, but those two
> are stretches.

Even if you are in the minority, it's not heretical to
have a better idea...that's why I asked what the point
of the question was--if their looking for the "ideal"
samurai, etc., then I'd point to Yamanaka Shikanosuke
(that is, until the very end...). As far as who I
"first" think of when the word is said, I probably
think of Nobunaga, but when I mentioned Musashi, it
was not my thinking, but unfortunately what I think
most people in the West would say.

Nate

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[Previous #3938] [Next #3941]

#3941 [2004-03-21 21:34:48]

Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by sengokudaimyo

Nate Ledbetter wrote:


> Oh come on, he's so cool! I used his business strategy
> to build my dot.com!
>
> And here I am, in the Army now....lol

I rest my case.

Tony

[Previous #3940] [Next #3943]

#3943 [2004-03-21 21:40:12]

Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by sengokudaimyo

Nate Ledbetter wrote:
> As far as who I
> "first" think of when the word is said, I probably
> think of Nobunaga, but when I mentioned Musashi, it
> was not my thinking, but unfortunately what I think
> most people in the West would say.

'Zactly.

Which makes me wonder... If someone *were* to pose this question to the
Japanese, I wonder who they would name. (After they stopped laughing and
tooth-sucking )

Tony

[Previous #3941] [Next #3945]

#3945 [2004-03-21 23:28:01]

Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by ltdomer98

--- "Anthony J. Bryant" <ajbryant@...> wrote:
> Which makes me wonder... If someone *were* to pose
> this question to the
> Japanese, I wonder who they would name. (After they
> stopped laughing and
> tooth-sucking )
>
> Tony

"Sou desu ne....*SUCK*...eee to....*suck*...yahari
Miyamoto Musashi deshou ka?" (The answer given to
gaijin).

"Nani, sonna baka na shitusmon...koitsu
omoshireendana...ja, sou ieba...Yoshitsune kana?" (The
inside their head version)

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[Previous #3943] [Next #3946]

#3946 [2004-03-21 23:34:24]

Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by sengokudaimyo

Nate Ledbetter wrote:


> "Sou desu ne....*SUCK*...eee to....*suck*...yahari
> Miyamoto Musashi deshou ka?" (The answer given to
> gaijin).
>
> "Nani, sonna baka na shitusmon...koitsu
> omoshireendana...ja, sou ieba...Yoshitsune kana?" (The
> inside their head version)
>

Mattaku dôiken!


Tony

[Previous #3945] [Next #3948]

#3948 [2004-03-21 22:27:30]

Re: most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by goldrushg

At 08:39 PM 3/21/04, Anthony J. Bryant wrote:
>Basically that there are many, many samurai who should be famous for their
>achievements, but all the samuraifanboys are in love with Musashi because
>he wrote a book.

Then many of those samurai fanboys should also love you, too, shouldn't
they? ;)


Mark Arsenault
Sengoku List Taisho
----------------------------------------------
http://www.sengoku.com - The official site of the Sengoku RPG!

[Previous #3946] [Next #3951]

#3951 [2004-03-22 01:46:35]

Re: most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by kentguy212002

The question appears who is the most famous general known outside of
japan then surely it mustbe adimiral yamamoto of pearl harbour and
midway fame. Im not sure if his family are samurai stock but the mand
deserves at least the same respect.

[Previous #3948] [Next #3952]

#3952 [2004-03-22 01:52:29]

Re: most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by midorinotoradesu

--- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, "Anthony J. Bryant" <
ajbryant@i...> wrote:
> Leonardo Lessa wrote:
>
> > but, what do you all mean by "sadly" Musashi is the most famous?
>
> Basically that there are many, many samurai who should be famous
for their
> achievements, but all the samuraifanboys are in love with Musashi
because he
> wrote a book.
>
>
> Tony

Isn't that why we're all in love with you?

Brandon

[Previous #3951] [Next #3953]

#3953 [2004-03-22 01:45:39]

Re: most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by midorinotoradesu

--- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, "cutetweety14" <
cutetweety14@y...> wrote:
> who do you think the most famous samurai is?
> ANSWER ASAP!!!!!!!!!

Tom Cruz?

Just kidding. I think Musashi at this point but Minamoto Yoshitsune
should be.

Brandon

[Previous #3952] [Next #3954]

#3954 [2004-03-22 02:21:47]

Re: most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by mahamayuri

Oh! Please Anthony!!!
"Just because he wrote a book"?!?!

Frantically!!!

Shingen Musashi no Kami Fujiwara no Genshin
THE Kensei!

He was much more than an master swordsman. He was a Saint of the sword!
He does not "just wrote a book". He was a great mikkyo gyoja, defeated more
than 200 warriors with metal sword, using just only an bokut� (bokken), and
was the patriarch of the Nitten Ryu!

If "just this" would not be enough acomplishments... Ye�re a very exigent
person...

Any samurai admirer should at least light an incense in memory of him.

Octavio Augusto Okimoto Alves de Carvalho
S�o Paulo - SP Brazil

>Message: 18
> Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 23:19:16 -0500
> From: "Anthony J. Bryant"
>Subject: Re: most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP
>
>Leonardo Lessa wrote:
>
>> but, what do you all mean by "sadly" Musashi is the most famous?
>
>Basically that there are many, many samurai who should be famous for their
>achievements, but all the samuraifanboys are in love with Musashi because
he
>wrote a book.
>
>Tony
>

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[Previous #3953] [Next #3957]

#3957 [2004-03-22 12:47:56]

Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by Qpaul3kato@wmconnect.com

Most would agree, the most famous would be Miyamota Musashi.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Previous #3954] [Next #3958]

#3958 [2004-03-22 19:18:50]

Re: most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by zevlord

Ok. Miyamoto Musashi was very famous in the U.S.A due to his book,(A
book of five rings) however just cause he was famous in the US
doesn't mean the most famous around the world, or does it? and
although the question was "who is the most famous samurai", doesn't
mean that he was the best (going out of contexts hear)but anyways. In
Japan Yagyu Jubei was the famous and romanticized of the samurai in
Japan's feudal era. anyways enough of my crap hope this help.

[Previous #3957] [Next #3960]

#3960 [2004-03-22 13:50:33]

Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by Leonardo Lessa

Undoubtelly, there were many others notable samurai. I know
that Musashi wrote a best-selling book but I still didnt read it. I know
about his history through the Eiji Yoshikawa`s book and I personally
found his lifestyle very interesting. Anyway, I know I have to read
to know more about other personalities from the bushido.

Leonardo



----- Original Message -----
From: "Anthony J. Bryant" <ajbryant@...>
To: <samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 1:19 AM
Subject: Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP


> Leonardo Lessa wrote:
>
> > but, what do you all mean by "sadly" Musashi is the most famous?
>
> Basically that there are many, many samurai who should be famous for their
> achievements, but all the samuraifanboys are in love with Musashi because
he
> wrote a book.
>
>
> Tony
>
>
>
>
> ---
> Samurai Archives: http://www.samurai-archives.com
> Samurai Archives store: http://www.cafeshops.com/samuraiarchives
> ---
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

[Previous #3958] [Next #3968]

#3968 [2004-03-23 03:51:47]

Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by nappy_ski_dude

Wait , wait. I thought Toshiro Mifune was the most famous samurai because he
was in all those movies.


hehe.



Randall Edwards






>From: Nate Ledbetter <ltdomer98@...>
>Reply-To: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
>To: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP
>Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 22:28:01 -0800 (PST)
>
>
>--- "Anthony J. Bryant" <ajbryant@...> wrote:
> > Which makes me wonder... If someone *were* to pose
> > this question to the
> > Japanese, I wonder who they would name. (After they
> > stopped laughing and
> > tooth-sucking )
> >
> > Tony
>
>"Sou desu ne....*SUCK*...eee to....*suck*...yahari
>Miyamoto Musashi deshou ka?" (The answer given to
>gaijin).
>
>"Nani, sonna baka na shitusmon...koitsu
>omoshireendana...ja, sou ieba...Yoshitsune kana?" (The
>inside their head version)
>
>__________________________________
>Do you Yahoo!?
>Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
>http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html

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[Previous #3960] [Next #3971]

#3971 [2004-03-23 14:16:22]

Re: [samuraihistory] Re: most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by sengokudaimyo

Medhal Mikit StXr-ljon Oddhinsson wrote:

> Oh! Please Anthony!!!
> "Just because he wrote a book"?!?!
>
> Frantically!!!
>
> Shingen Musashi no Kami Fujiwara no Genshin
> THE Kensei!
>
> He was much more than an master swordsman. He was a Saint of the sword!
> He does not "just wrote a book". He was a great mikkyo gyoja, defeated more
> than 200 warriors with metal sword, using just only an bokutô (bokken), and
> was the patriarch of the Nitten Ryu!

ummmm....

sure. Okay.



Tony

[Previous #3968] [Next #3976]

#3976 [2004-03-23 16:11:28]

Re: most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by zevlord

> Oh! Please Anthony!!!
> "Just because he wrote a book"?!?!
>
> Frantically!!!
>
> Shingen Musashi no Kami Fujiwara no Genshin
> THE Kensei!
>
> He was much more than an master swordsman. He was a Saint of the
sword!
> He does not "just wrote a book". He was a great mikkyo gyoja,
defeated more
> than 200 warriors with metal sword, using just only an bokutô
(bokken), and
> was the patriarch of the Nitten Ryu!
>
> If "just this" would not be enough acomplishments... Ye´re a very
exigent
> person...
>
> Any samurai admirer should at least light an incense in memory of
him.
>
> Octavio Augusto Okimoto Alves de Carvalho
> São Paulo - SP Brazil

This information was taken from:
Cleary, Thomas The Japanese Art of War Shambala 1991
Miyamoto Musashi (trans. Thomas Cleary) The Book of Five Rings
Shambala 1994
Turnbull, Stephen The Lone Samurai and the Martial Arts Arms and
Armour 1990
Yoshikawa Eiji Musashi Kodansha 1981

Much of Musashi's life between 1600 and 1640 is the stuff of legend
and some have postulated that he served at Osaka Castle (1614-1615)
on the defending side, taking quite a few heads in the process. In a
similar vein, he is sometimes said to have helped quell the Shimabara
Rebellion of 1638 - a theory which, as with his glories at Osaka, is
impossible to prove.

On the other hand, many of the important events depicted in Yoshikawa
Eiji's famous novel Musashi have a basis in reality, to include his
battle with the Yoshioka School

Musashi has enjoyed an immense popularity in the 20th Century and
beyond, largely as a result of Yoshikawa's novel (which was
originally published in serialized form in the Asahi Shimbun).
Musashi skillfully weaves fact and fiction together to create an
engrossing tale that has experienced increasing reknown in the West.
Interestingly, the Asahi Shimbun noted in 1988 that at least one Edo
Period source questioned Musashi's duel with Sasaki, stating that
Musashi was not alone at the fight, and that his followers killed
Ganryu when he had been knocked down to the ground

[Previous #3971] [Next #3978]

#3978 [2004-03-23 16:28:42]

Re: [samuraihistory] Re: most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by goodfella26426

rock on.. Musashi is deffinitely my favourite.. Im glad someone else thinx the same..
--

--------- Original Message ---------

DATE: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:21:47
From: Medhal Mikit St�r-ljon Oddhinsson <medhal8@...>
To: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
Cc:

>Oh! Please Anthony!!!
>"Just because he wrote a book"?!?!
>
>Frantically!!!
>
>Shingen Musashi no Kami Fujiwara no Genshin
>THE Kensei!
>
>He was much more than an master swordsman. He was a Saint of the sword!
>He does not "just wrote a book". He was a great mikkyo gyoja, defeated more
>than 200 warriors with metal sword, using just only an bokut� (bokken), and
>was the patriarch of the Nitten Ryu!
>
>If "just this" would not be enough acomplishments... Ye�re a very exigent
>person...
>
>Any samurai admirer should at least light an incense in memory of him.
>
>Octavio Augusto Okimoto Alves de Carvalho
>S�o Paulo - SP Brazil
>
>>Message: 18
>> Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 23:19:16 -0500
>> From: "Anthony J. Bryant"
>>Subject: Re: most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP
>>
>>Leonardo Lessa wrote:
>>
>>> but, what do you all mean by "sadly" Musashi is the most famous?
>>
>>Basically that there are many, many samurai who should be famous for their
>>achievements, but all the samuraifanboys are in love with Musashi because
>he
>>wrote a book.
>>
>>Tony
>>
>
>_________________________________________________________
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>
>
>
>
>
>---
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>
>
>
>
>
>



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[Previous #3976] [Next #3981]

#3981 [2004-03-23 11:28:52]

Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by kentguy212002

Randall Edwards <tcma66@...> wrote:Wait , wait. I thought Toshiro Mifune was the most famous samurai because he
was in all those movies.


hehe.



Randall Edwards



yojimbo rocks , mifune was a class act.


>From: Nate Ledbetter
>Reply-To: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
>To: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP
>Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 22:28:01 -0800 (PST)
>
>
>--- "Anthony J. Bryant" wrote:
> > Which makes me wonder... If someone *were* to pose
> > this question to the
> > Japanese, I wonder who they would name. (After they
> > stopped laughing and
> > tooth-sucking )
> >
> > Tony
>
>"Sou desu ne....*SUCK*...eee to....*suck*...yahari
>Miyamoto Musashi deshou ka?" (The answer given to
>gaijin).
>
>"Nani, sonna baka na shitusmon...koitsu
>omoshireendana...ja, sou ieba...Yoshitsune kana?" (The
>inside their head version)
>
>__________________________________
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[Previous #3978] [Next #3990]

#3990 [2004-03-24 00:02:18]

Re: [samuraihistory] Re: most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by sengokudaimyo

Josh Wilson wrote:

> rock on.. Musashi is deffinitely my favourite.. Im glad someone else thinx the same..

One must ask:

How many others do you KNOW?


Tony

[Previous #3981] [Next #3996]

#3996 [2004-03-24 07:36:46]

Re: most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by midorinotoradesu

While he was a great Admiral maybe even a genius, he was not samurai.
So the question posed "most famous samurai" must address a period in
which samurai existed. WWII was not such a perod.
BTW, according to an authorized biography he was not of samurai
bloodline but was adopted by the Yamamoto family to perpetuate their
name. It was a great name and he was a great man. (But I don't like
him because he bombed my family on Oahu).

Brandon
--- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, "kentguy212002" wrote:
> The question appears who is the most famous general known outside
of
> japan then surely it mustbe adimiral yamamoto of pearl harbour and
> midway fame. Im not sure if his family are samurai stock but the
mand
> deserves at least the same respect.

[Previous #3990] [Next #4007]

#4007 [2004-03-24 16:39:47]

Re: [samuraihistory] Re: most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by goodfella26426

Lots more than you think Tony..






--

--------- Original Message ---------
DATE: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 02:02:18
From: "Anthony J. Bryant" <ajbryant@...>
To: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
Cc:

Josh Wilson wrote:

> rock on.. Musashi is deffinitely my favourite.. Im glad someone else thinx the same..

One must ask:

How many others do you KNOW?


Tony




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[Previous #3996] [Next #4019]

#4019 [2004-03-25 02:27:50]

Re: [samuraihistory] Re: most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by kentguy212002

Thank you for a more degnified reply then what i usually get. I still believe oda nobunaga due to his tactical genius

midorinotoradesu <bkirkham@...> wrote:While he was a great Admiral maybe even a genius, he was not samurai.
So the question posed "most famous samurai" must address a period in
which samurai existed. WWII was not such a perod.
BTW, according to an authorized biography he was not of samurai
bloodline but was adopted by the Yamamoto family to perpetuate their
name. It was a great name and he was a great man. (But I don't like
him because he bombed my family on Oahu).

Brandon
--- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, "kentguy212002" wrote:
> The question appears who is the most famous general known outside
of
> japan then surely it mustbe adimiral yamamoto of pearl harbour and
> midway fame. Im not sure if his family are samurai stock but the
mand
> deserves at least the same respect.



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[Previous #4007] [Next #4021]

#4021 [2004-03-25 06:52:14]

Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by Michael Peters

Hmm,

Posed to my students. My replies were Nobunaga Oda, Uesugi Kenshin,
Asikaga Takauji,and Yagyu Muneyori. They all agreed with Yoshitsune however.
Of course this was two ladies in thier mid-50's. Musashi NEVER came up.

BTW, we don't love Tony cause he wrote a book, It's because of the gentle
guidence he provides those poor lost fanboys. ;)

Mykaru
> > > Which makes me wonder... If someone *were* to pose
> > > this question to the
> > > Japanese, I wonder who they would name. (After they
> > > stopped laughing and
> > > tooth-sucking )
> > >
> > > Tony
> >
> >"Sou desu ne....*SUCK*...eee to....*suck*...yahari
> >Miyamoto Musashi deshou ka?" (The answer given to
> >gaijin).
> >
> >"Nani, sonna baka na shitusmon...koitsu
> >omoshireendana...ja, sou ieba...Yoshitsune kana?" (The
> >inside their head version)

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[Previous #4019] [Next #4034]

#4034 [2004-03-25 23:04:02]

Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by cepooooo

On Mar 25, 2004, at 3:52 AM, Michael Peters wrote:

>   Hmm,
>
>   Posed to my students. My replies were Nobunaga Oda, Uesugi Kenshin,
> Asikaga Takauji,and Yagyu Muneyori. They all agreed with Yoshitsune
> however.
> Of course this was two ladies in thier mid-50's. Musashi NEVER came
> up.

Technically speaking... was Musashi a samurai?
Ok, he was born in the samurai class, but in the end he had no lord,
right?
So, can't we disqualify him?

I think Nobunaga should be #1, for the way he lived and died.

cheers,
cepo


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Previous #4021] [Next #4036]

#4036 [2004-03-26 04:54:22]

Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by tbsorrentino

Hullo CEPO,

Nate was kind enough to address a similar question I´ve posed. His remarks are very interesting. Perhaps you can rummage throughout the archives to retrieve it.

On European Feudal and Ancient systems, the sole fact of birth was enough to qualify entrance to a class. However, before Japanese standarts, the lord-serf (is there a better term? In portuguese we have "vassalagem", which I would translate as "retainership") relationship was essential, or wasn´t it? If it wasn´t essential, what´s the purpose of the concept of "ronin"?

Cheers,

Thiago

p.s.: btw, CEPO, are you an Italian Citizen? Please reply pvt, I would like to pose a few questions on Italy.
p.s.2: Octavio, do you undergo trainning at the Niten Institute in Brazil?
----- Original Message -----
From: Cesare Polenghi
To: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, March 26, 2004 3:04 AM
Subject: Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP


On Mar 25, 2004, at 3:52 AM, Michael Peters wrote:

> Hmm,
>
> Posed to my students. My replies were Nobunaga Oda, Uesugi Kenshin,
> Asikaga Takauji,and Yagyu Muneyori. They all agreed with Yoshitsune
> however.
> Of course this was two ladies in thier mid-50's. Musashi NEVER came
> up.

Technically speaking... was Musashi a samurai?
Ok, he was born in the samurai class, but in the end he had no lord,
right?
So, can't we disqualify him?

I think Nobunaga should be #1, for the way he lived and died.

cheers,
cepo


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
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[Previous #4034] [Next #4038]

#4038 [2004-03-26 06:26:48]

Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by nappy_ski_dude

This message may be a little late but I believe that Saigo Takamori would be
the most popular, at least in my humble opinion. I still have alot to learn
so this might be a limited view so far.










>From: Cesare Polenghi <cepo@...>
>Reply-To: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
>To: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP
>Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:04:02 -1000
>
>On Mar 25, 2004, at 3:52 AM, Michael Peters wrote:
>
> > � Hmm,
> >
> > � Posed to my students. My replies were Nobunaga Oda, Uesugi Kenshin,
> > Asikaga Takauji,and Yagyu Muneyori. They all agreed with Yoshitsune
> > however.
> > Of course this was two ladies in thier mid-50's. Musashi NEVER came
> > up.
>
>Technically speaking... was Musashi a samurai?
>Ok, he was born in the samurai class, but in the end he had no lord,
>right?
>So, can't we disqualify him?
>
>I think Nobunaga should be #1, for the way he lived and died.
>
>cheers,
>cepo
>
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

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[Previous #4036] [Next #4047]

#4047 [2004-03-27 07:49:36]

Re: [samuraihistory] most famous samurai? ANSWER ASAP

by cepooooo

On Mar 26, 2004, at 1:54 AM, Thiago Sorrentino wrote:

>
> p.s.: btw, CEPO, are you an Italian Citizen? Please reply pvt, I
> would like to pose a few questions on Italy.

Ouch... yeah... well... kinda...
Write in private if you want.
cepo


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Previous #4038]


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