question....

Does anybody here have indepth knowledge about the Shimabara rebellion of 1637-38? All I know is that Japanese Christians got fed up w/ the local tax collectors.

Thanks.

Gabs

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I don't know too much about it, but I got the impression from a
Japanese history teacher years ago that the whole 'Christian
connection' was a lot of propaganda, and an excuse to go after the
christians. They apparently weren't really directly related, or the
issue was just food or taxes or something, and had nothing to do with
religeon. Maybe someone on this list can go into better detail...

--- In samuraihistory@y..., "gabriel d gabaya" wrote:
> Does anybody here have indepth knowledge about the Shimabara
rebellion of 1637-38? All I know is that Japanese Christians got fed
up w/ the local tax collectors.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Gabs
>
> _______________________________________
> EDSAMAIL. Internet the way YOU WANT IT.
> www.edsamail.com.ph

The daimyo in charge, Matsukura, was not only squeezing the population
for taxes,
he was also ferocious in his persecution of anyone suspected of being a
Christian.
The litany of tortures he practiced is stomach churning.

The rebellion had a strong religious flavor to it because of a
charismatic Christian youth,
Amakusa Shiro, who became its de facto leader. The rebels inflicted a
series
of ignominious defeats on the besieging samurai armies and so alarmed
the Shogunate that
help was requested from the Dutch, who obliged by attacking the rebels
from the sea
with naval cannon.

Matsudaira Nobutsuna, the commander sent by the Shogunate to end
the uprising, opted for a lengthy siege, only concluding with a final
assault when
the rebels supplies had been exhausted and starvation had set in.

There is a good description of the Shimabara rebellion in Ivan Morris' book
"The Nobility of Failure" in the chapter entitled, "Amakusa Shiro -
Japanese Messiah."

gabriel d gabaya wrote:

> Does anybody here have indepth knowledge about the Shimabara rebellion
> of 1637-38? All I know is that Japanese Christians got fed up w/ the
> local tax collectors.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Gabs
>
> _______________________________________
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> www.edsamail.com.ph
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I really wish I could tell you, but I really don't
that kind of informantion. I haven't studied that far
into the Japanese history.

--- gabriel d gabaya <goodah@...> wrote:

> Does anybody here have indepth knowledge about the
> Shimabara rebellion of 1637-38? All I know is that
> Japanese Christians got fed up w/ the local tax
> collectors.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Gabs
>
> _______________________________________
> EDSAMAIL. Internet the way YOU WANT IT.
> www.edsamail.com.ph
>
>
> Samurai Archives: http://www.samurai-archives.com
> ---
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> samuraihistory-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
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>

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Hi Gabs

As usual there is more to the "subject" than first meets the eye!! I have been undertaking some research on this topic and it may, one day, see the light of day in a book!! However in the meantime......

There is an interesting chapter in Ivan Morris' Book " The Nobility of Failure" (ISBN 0-03-010811-X) Pub. 1975 which covers the "Japanese Messiah" and aspects covering the Shimabara Rebellion. It is also briefly mentioned in Stephen Turnbull's "Samurai Sourcebook" under the Seige of Hara 1637-38 and several other of his works.

There are also some interesting articles to be found on the "NET" if you search for "Amakusa Shiro" (the messiah), Shimabara or Hara.

Good luck with the hunt, I am sure you will find it an interesting topic.... the last full, true samurai campaign.

Rod Johnson

----- Original Message -----
From: gabriel d gabaya
To: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, December 02, 2002 2:41 PM
Subject: [samuraihistory] question....


Does anybody here have indepth knowledge about the Shimabara rebellion of 1637-38? All I know is that Japanese Christians got fed up w/ the local tax collectors.

Thanks.

Gabs





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

You might try Ivan Morris 'Nobility of Failure' has a chapter about Amakusa
Shirothe 'leader' of the rebellion. Also James Murdochs 2nd volume of his
history of Japan has a lot of detail but a dated perspective.

Maybe a movie should be made about Amakura Shiro--the Japanese Braveheart.

samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com wrote:

>The daimyo in charge, Matsukura, was not only squeezing the population
>for taxes,
>he was also ferocious in his persecution of anyone suspected of being a
>Christian.
>The litany of tortures he practiced is stomach churning.

Did this include the so-called 'water cure?'

>
>The rebellion had a strong religious flavor to it because of a
>charismatic Christian youth,
>Amakusa Shiro, who became its de facto leader. The rebels inflicted a
>series
>of ignominious defeats on the besieging samurai armies and so alarmed
>the Shogunate that
>help was requested from the Dutch, who obliged by attacking the rebels
>from the sea
>with naval cannon.
>
>Matsudaira Nobutsuna, the commander sent by the Shogunate to end
>the uprising, opted for a lengthy siege, only concluding with a final
>assault when
>the rebels supplies had been exhausted and starvation had set in.
>
>There is a good description of the Shimabara rebellion in Ivan Morris' book
>"The Nobility of Failure" in the chapter entitled, "Amakusa Shiro -
>Japanese Messiah."
>
>gabriel d gabaya wrote:
>
>> Does anybody here have indepth knowledge about the Shimabara rebellion
>> of 1637-38? All I know is that Japanese Christians got fed up w/ the
>> local tax collectors.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> Gabs
>>
>> _______________________________________
>> EDSAMAIL. Internet the way YOU WANT IT.
>> www.edsamail.com.ph
>>
>>
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>>
>>
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>
>
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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--- In samuraihistory@y..., "gabriel d gabaya" wrote:

> Maybe a movie should be made about Amakura Shiro--the Japanese

Braveheart.


ZEY'LL NEBAA TAKE... OUAH FLEEDOM!

samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com wrote:

>The daimyo in charge, Matsukura, was not only squeezing the population
>for taxes,
>he was also ferocious in his persecution of anyone suspected of being a
>Christian.
>The litany of tortures he practiced is stomach churning.

Just read about it on the net. Obstreperous peasants were compelled to wear straw raincoats w/c were then set alight. Others were hauled off to Mt.Unzen and then tossed into the sulfur springs to be scalded to death.

>
>The rebellion had a strong religious flavor to it because of a
>charismatic Christian youth,
>Amakusa Shiro, who became its de facto leader. The rebels inflicted a
>series
>of ignominious defeats on the besieging samurai armies and so alarmed
>the Shogunate that
>help was requested from the Dutch, who obliged by attacking the rebels
>from the sea
>with naval cannon.

So the Dutch War of Independence, that lasted for 80 years b/w the Spain and the Low Countries, the latter aided and abetted by England, was being played out in Kyushu, where the Calvinist Protestants hurled shot after shot at the Shimabara rebels who were most likely papists under the influence of the Iberian Jesuits and Dominicans. The shogunate played off the Protestants against the Catholics in this episode.

>
>Matsudaira Nobutsuna, the commander sent by the Shogunate to end
>the uprising, opted for a lengthy siege, only concluding with a final
>assault when
>the rebels supplies had been exhausted and starvation had set in.
>
>There is a good description of the Shimabara rebellion in Ivan Morris' book
>"The Nobility of Failure" in the chapter entitled, "Amakusa Shiro -
>Japanese Messiah."
>
>gabriel d gabaya wrote:
>
>> Does anybody here have indepth knowledge about the Shimabara rebellion
>> of 1637-38? All I know is that Japanese Christians got fed up w/ the
>> local tax collectors.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> Gabs
>>
>> _______________________________________
>> EDSAMAIL. Internet the way YOU WANT IT.
>> www.edsamail.com.ph
>>
>>
>> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
>> ADVERTISEMENT
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>>
>>
>>
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>
>
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