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Novelist needs Japanese male name

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#6966 [2005-04-22 07:09:11]

Novelist needs Japanese male name

by kaliender

I wonder If you can help me, or point me in the right direction. I am
a novelist, and am trying to find a suitable name (forename and
surname) for one of my characters, who is Japanese.

This person is descended from a famous samurai, with a first name that
has some reference to the meaning of one or more of the following:
truth, honour, honesty, virtue, loyal, impeccable.

I cannot use Makoto for the forename. I would prefer the forename to
be easily shortened according to English principles (i.e. "Tad" for
Tadaka), and I would like the surname to be connected to any
well-known samurai family or clan in Japanese history, preferably
someone heroic. Ideally in the Shimazu family, but not necessarily.


If you can be of any assistance I would be incredibly grateful. If I
choose a name that is given to me, I will acknowledge the person in my
'thank you' section in the book.

I do not read or speak Japanese.

[Next #6967]

#6967 [2005-04-22 18:48:39]

Re: Novelist needs Japanese male name

by kitsuno

--- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, "kaliender"
wrote:
>
>
> I wonder If you can help me, or point me in the right direction. I
am
> a novelist, and am trying to find a suitable name (forename and
> surname) for one of my characters, who is Japanese.
>
> This person is descended from a famous samurai, with a first name
that
> has some reference to the meaning of one or more of the following:
> truth, honour, honesty, virtue, loyal, impeccable.
>
> I cannot use Makoto for the forename. I would prefer the forename
to
> be easily shortened according to English principles (i.e. "Tad" for
> Tadaka), and I would like the surname to be connected to any
> well-known samurai family or clan in Japanese history, preferably
> someone heroic. Ideally in the Shimazu family, but not necessarily.
>
>
> If you can be of any assistance I would be incredibly grateful. If
I
> choose a name that is given to me, I will acknowledge the person
in my
> 'thank you' section in the book.
>
> I do not read or speak Japanese.

You can't shorted Japanese names "according to English principles"
and have them mean anything to other Japanese. If your story was to
take place in Japan, "Tad" wouldn't mean anything to another
Japanese person. They don't shorten names like that. If it takes
place in an English speaking place around English speakers, then
obviously that wouldnt matter. As for "Makoto", what's wrong
with "Mack"?

[Previous #6966] [Next #6968]

#6968 [2005-04-22 19:02:07]

Re: [samuraihistory] Re: Novelist needs Japanese male name

by fighterpilot74403

how bout "junya"(my nick name)

junya

Kitsuno <samurai-listowner@...> wrote:

--- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, "kaliender"
wrote:
>
>
> I wonder If you can help me, or point me in the right direction. I
am
> a novelist, and am trying to find a suitable name (forename and
> surname) for one of my characters, who is Japanese.
>
> This person is descended from a famous samurai, with a first name
that
> has some reference to the meaning of one or more of the following:
> truth, honour, honesty, virtue, loyal, impeccable.
>
> I cannot use Makoto for the forename. I would prefer the forename
to
> be easily shortened according to English principles (i.e. "Tad" for
> Tadaka), and I would like the surname to be connected to any
> well-known samurai family or clan in Japanese history, preferably
> someone heroic. Ideally in the Shimazu family, but not necessarily.
>
>
> If you can be of any assistance I would be incredibly grateful. If
I
> choose a name that is given to me, I will acknowledge the person
in my
> 'thank you' section in the book.
>
> I do not read or speak Japanese.

You can't shorted Japanese names "according to English principles"
and have them mean anything to other Japanese. If your story was to
take place in Japan, "Tad" wouldn't mean anything to another
Japanese person. They don't shorten names like that. If it takes
place in an English speaking place around English speakers, then
obviously that wouldnt matter. As for "Makoto", what's wrong
with "Mack"?





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[Previous #6967] [Next #6970]

#6970 [2005-04-22 20:25:10]

Re: [samuraihistory] Novelist needs Japanese male name

by ahelly69

I recommended you the surename: Takagi and as the name:

Jintaro
Jutaro
Jingoro

Good luck!

Helly Angel from Venezuela

kaliender <kaliender@...> wrote:


I wonder If you can help me, or point me in the right direction. I am
a novelist, and am trying to find a suitable name (forename and
surname) for one of my characters, who is Japanese.

This person is descended from a famous samurai, with a first name that
has some reference to the meaning of one or more of the following:
truth, honour, honesty, virtue, loyal, impeccable.

I cannot use Makoto for the forename. I would prefer the forename to
be easily shortened according to English principles (i.e. "Tad" for
Tadaka), and I would like the surname to be connected to any
well-known samurai family or clan in Japanese history, preferably
someone heroic. Ideally in the Shimazu family, but not necessarily.


If you can be of any assistance I would be incredibly grateful. If I
choose a name that is given to me, I will acknowledge the person in my
'thank you' section in the book.

I do not read or speak Japanese.








---
Join the 2005 'Samurai Fiction' contest:
http://www.samurai-archives.com/writcon.html
Samurai Archives: http://www.samurai-archives.com
Samurai Archives store: http://www.cafeshops.com/samuraiarchives
---



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[Previous #6968] [Next #6971]

#6971 [2005-04-23 00:05:58]

Re: [samuraihistory] Novelist needs Japanese male name

by cepooooo

Ken?


cepo

[Previous #6970] [Next #6972]

#6972 [2005-04-23 00:53:16]

Re: [samuraihistory] Novelist needs Japanese male name

by ltdomer98

--- kaliender <kaliender@...> wrote:

> This person is descended from a famous samurai, with
> a first name that
> has some reference to the meaning of one or more of
> the following:
> truth, honour, honesty, virtue, loyal, impeccable.

Does this mean that your character is in the present
time? Time period makes a big difference in Japanese
personal names. Not too many "Daisuke"s running around
in the 1400s, but there are plenty now.

> I cannot use Makoto for the forename.

Why not? Knowing why not might help us suggest an
alternative.

I would prefer
> the forename to
> be easily shortened according to English principles
> (i.e. "Tad" for
> Tadaka),

As Kitsuno said, the Japanese don't shorten their
names according to "English" principles. If you are
having him interact with non-Japanese characters for
the most part, then I can see them giving him an
"English" nickname, like the example you use above.
(Being as "Tad" is unpronounceable by a Japanese, it's
not likely to stick--it would come out "Tada" or
"Taddo". I'm not familiar with 'Tadaka' as a given
name either, but I suppose it could be one...maybe.)

More and more Japanese given names ARE short
enough--hard to shorten "Shinya" or "Jun", though
"Jun" could itself be short for "Junpei",
"Junichirou", or 1000 other names. You could take
"Daisuke" and make it "Dice" (kinda cool), or
Ryuutarou and make it "Ryu", or something like that.

and I would like the surname to be
> connected to any
> well-known samurai family or clan in Japanese
> history, preferably
> someone heroic. Ideally in the Shimazu family, but
> not necessarily.

In the Shimazu family? Then you've got your
name--Shimazu. If you mean connect ed to the Shimazu
family, I'm sure someone here can dig up the names of
a few of their retainer families. Something that
recognizable would be a little odd, but not unheard
of, and that may be the effect you are going for.

> I do not read or speak Japanese.

Happy to help--but I'm not going to just throw random
names out there without getting a better idea of what
you are looking for. I don't know whether the others
who've chimed in (sans Kitsuno, who I know speaks
Japanese) have any knowledge or background, but for
myself, I live in Japan, speak Japanese, watch way too
much TV, and generally am surrounded by Japanese names
all the time. Let me know if your time period is
modern or historical, what meanings you're hoping to
include (you did in the email, so I can go with those
if nothing else) and clarify the "nickname" thing, and
we should be able to help.

Nate

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#6973 [2005-04-23 00:54:55]

Re: [samuraihistory] Novelist needs Japanese male name

by ltdomer98

--- Cepo <cepo@...> wrote:
> Ken?
>
>
> cepo

Ce--

Forgive me, I hadn't gotten to your reply here when I
wrote that I didn't know if anyone throwing out names
spoke Japanese or not, sans K :)

Ken's a pretty reliable standby, isn't it? And
transfers well to English. Which I guess is why I know
a ton of Nisei named "Ken"...

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[Previous #6972] [Next #7126]

#7126 [2005-05-14 10:08:59]

Re: [samuraihistory] Novelist needs Japanese male name

by kaliender

Hi Nate, (and others)

I apologise for getting back to this so late. I've
been
'offline'.


> Does this mean that your character is in the present
> time?

Yes.

> > I cannot use Makoto for the forename.


> Why not? Knowing why not might help us suggest an
> alternative.

I would be liable for libel :-) Need I say more?


> As Kitsuno said, the Japanese don't shorten their
> names according to "English" principles. If you are
> having him interact with non-Japanese characters for
> the most part, then I can see them giving him an
> "English" nickname, like the example you use above.\

Yes, he interacts with non-Japanese speakers for the
most part. And I have to say my personal experience is
that many Japanese names are shortened according to
English principles. My experience being with several
Canadian born Japanese( with Japanese names,
shortened. Tad was one of them).

AND I don't want to get into a discussion about this
aspect, it is not the important part.


> "Daisuke" and make it "Dice" (kinda cool),

Yes, very cool!

What I need to know is what Daisuke means! Is it a
surname or forename?

Helly Angel said:

I recommended you the surename: Takagi and as the
name:

Jintaro
Jutaro
Jingoro

all "sound" good to me, but again I need to know why
Takagi - what is the history here?

And what the forenames he suggested actually mean.

Another person reccomended Reiichi as being
"Trustworthy first son". Is this correct?

Many thanks for all suggestions and help!

Kali



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[Previous #6973] [Next #7143]

#7143 [2005-05-24 16:56:06]

Re: [samuraihistory] Novelist needs Japanese male name

by ltdomer98

Sorry, I've been here and there. Hope this helps.


--- Kali Ender <kaliender@...> wrote:
> > Does this mean that your character is in the
> present
> > time?
>
> Yes.

Okay--names today are a little different than they
would be in the 16th century or so. Helps to know when
we're talking about.

> > > I cannot use Makoto for the forename.
>
>
> > Why not? Knowing why not might help us suggest an
> > alternative.
>
> I would be liable for libel :-) Need I say more?

Um...yeah. If I used the name "Jim" in a story, that
doesn't mean anyone named Jim would be suing me if
they didn't like what I wrote. So yes, you need to say
more for me to understand why you can't use it. Though
I suppose "I don't want to" would explain it well
enough.


> Yes, he interacts with non-Japanese speakers for the
> most part. And I have to say my personal experience
> is
> that many Japanese names are shortened according to
> English principles. My experience being with several
> Canadian born Japanese( with Japanese names,
> shortened. Tad was one of them).

Canadian-born Japanese, not Japanese-born Japanese.
"Tad" isn't pronounceable to a native Japanese
speaker--the only final consonant in Japanese is "N",
so Tad would come out "Taddo". But, if he's being
given the nickname by non-Japanese, then it would
follow their patterns, not Japanese ones. Assuming the
American/Canadian/whatever in your story are the ones
giving him the nickname, this should be fine.

> > "Daisuke" and make it "Dice" (kinda cool),
>
> Yes, very cool!
>
> What I need to know is what Daisuke means! Is it a
> surname or forename?

大助 "Great Help"--could almost be
stretched to "Savior", without getting biblical or
anything. Dai is Big, Great, etc.; Suke used above is
the same as tasukeru, to save. It's a given name, not
a family name--are you looking for family names also?


> Helly Angel said:
>
> I recommended you the surename: Takagi and as the
> name:
>
> Jintaro
> Jutaro
> Jingoro
>
> all "sound" good to me, but again I need to know why
> Takagi - what is the history here?
>
> And what the forenames he suggested actually mean.

高木:Tall Tree. Not sure what
history Helly is alluding to.

甚太郎 Jintarou
重太郎 Juutarou
甚五郎 Jingorou

I don't have a name dictionary, so I can only help a
little on the names he's given. "Tarou"
太郎 means "Eldest son" or "First Son".
When I typed in the names in Japanese, the above is
what came out. Not sure what the "Jin" is in the first
and third names, but "Juu" means heavy
(omoi--重い). The "Gorou" in the third
means "5th Son".

> Another person reccomended Reiichi as being
> "Trustworthy first son". Is this correct?

礼一 Hmmm..."Respectful First" (It
doesn't actually contain anything like -rou that says
son, but it's implied, really.) That's what I come up
with.

This may all be OBE for you--if so, sorry about that.
Between work travel and finding out I'm going to be a
dad, it's been a busy month.




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[Previous #7126] [Next #7229]

#7229 [2005-06-08 02:25:50]

Re: [samuraihistory] Novelist needs Japanese male name

by kaliender

Thanks Nate, all very helpful.
Congratulations on being a Dad.. I've just found out
I'm going to be an Auntie.

Just to clarify, if you are interested -

> Um...yeah. If I used the name "Jim" in a story, that
> doesn't mean anyone named Jim would be suing me if
> they didn't like what I wrote. So yes, you need to
> say
> more for me to understand why you can't use it.
> Though

The character in the novel is based very closely on a
true-life person with the name Makoto.

> Canadian-born Japanese, not Japanese-born Japanese.
> "Tad" isn't pronounceable to a native Japanese
> speaker--the only final consonant in Japanese is
> "N",
> so Tad would come out "Taddo". But, if he's being
> given the nickname by non-Japanese, then it would
> follow their patterns, not Japanese ones. Assuming
> the
> American/Canadian/whatever in your story are the
> ones
> giving him the nickname, this should be fine.

Well, as I said, the character (and the story) are
based on real events and people, and in this 'real
event / people' situation, believe it or not the name
Tad was used by the persons Japanese speaking/ born
friends. Perhaps they didn't originally give it to
him, but there you go. The Japanese in the story/truth
spent most of their lives in Canada, probably explains
it.

thanks for your help!

all the best.



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