Compare & Contrast: Feudal Japan vs. 20th Century America

Hello All...i am currently writing a paper (as the title suggests) for my college English class an i am seeking some assistance in ensuring my desired point is obtained. I wish to illustrate (in my humble opinion) how a melding of aspects of both societies doctrines would produce a better 21st century America. My query is this: should i just explain it point to point (i.e., Japan's feudal caste system vs. America's free democratic society) or should i find an actual period in Japan's history to compare to 20th Century America? Like the Heian period or the Kamakura period? Any assitance or constructive criticism will be greatly appreciated.

--- On Sun 02/06, Michael Peters < shdwstel@... > wrote:
From: Michael Peters [mailto: shdwstel@...]
To: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 06:03:49 +0700
Subject: RE: [samuraihistory] Re: Seeking kura information








I SHOULD be in Tokyo within the next 2 weeks. I know one of the antique

stores I will be visiting has bits (saddles as well) if you'd like me to get

you some prices.



M.J.Peters



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On Feb 6, 2005, at 1:48 PM, Jason wrote:

> Hello All...i am currently writing a paper (as the title suggests) for
> my college English class an i am seeking some assistance in ensuring
> my desired point is obtained. I wish to illustrate (in my humble
> opinion) how a melding of aspects of both societies doctrines would
> produce a better 21st century America. My query is this: should i just
> explain it point to point (i.e., Japan's feudal caste system vs.
> America's free democratic society) or should i find an actual period
> in Japan's history to compare to 20th Century America? Like the Heian
> period or the Kamakura period? Any assitance or constructive criticism
> will be greatly appreciated.

Personally, I believe that whichever aspects of the past of Japan you
compare with contemporary US is probably going to generate a weird
paper.
As far as you don't want to go for a George W Bush vs. Nobunaga
comparison.. (<- joke).
I think a more interesting compare-contrast paper could be one between
Mujadeens (such as the Talibans) and some religiously fanatic Ikki
during Sengoku.
Anyway, just my ideas. Good luck.
cepo

>
> On Feb 6, 2005, at 1:48 PM, Jason wrote:
>
> > Hello All...i am currently writing a paper (as the title suggests) for
> > my college English class an i am seeking some assistance in

ensuring

> > my desired point is obtained. I wish to illustrate (in my humble
> > opinion) how a melding of aspects of both societies doctrines

would

> > produce a better 21st century America. My query is this: should i

just

> > explain it point to point (i.e., Japan's feudal caste system vs.
> > America's free democratic society) or should i find an actual period
> > in Japan's history to compare to 20th Century America? Like the

Heian

> > period or the Kamakura period? Any assitance or constructive

criticism

> > will be greatly appreciated.

Can't help feeling intrigued by this -partly because an economist friend
of mine is studying how the Japanese economy arrived at the 21st
century by a different route to Western countries, but competitive with
them.

My next thought was that a feudal system is not really a stable system
in itself as it is usually in a constant state of self-defence and then
replaced fairly rapidly by centralised government.

The Japanese central government under the Tokugawa shogunate was
successful in that it brought 250 years of peace.

Maybe you could look at the Tokugawa period (1603 to 1868) and
consider the characteristics of the Tokugawa system which made it
relatively easy for the Meiji government to strong-arm the country into
modernising: vertical hierarchies, neo-Confucianism, a relatively docile
and obedient population, a thriving pre-industrial merchant economy
etc, and some of the costs to the population - stifling of individual
opinion and protest, often with great cruelty, a repressive society with
elements of a police state, much informing on neighbours and so on,
all of which have made it really hard for the Japanese to embrace
Western style democracy in any realistic fashion or to have many forms
of public protest.

I wonder if this relative ease with which government decisions are
enforced won't make life simpler for countries like Japan and China as
the century continues and really difficult decisions re consumption and
environment have to be made by the world's governments. A tokugawa
style despot who can make laws and enforce them may be the "best"
form of government, but I hope he/she is an enlightened one!

Just some random thoughts. Anyone want to discuss further?

Gillian

>
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Hi all -

In Ikegami Eiko's 'The Taming of the Samurai' she points to the
emergence of a kind of fledgling democracy at village level, in
associations of mutual protection (ikki), signified by a 'round
robin' document (rensho kishomon) signed by all but with no
indication of priority or seniority.

This process began to spread, but was ruthlessley put down by
the stronger daimyo who had no intention of delegating power
on any kind of equal basis.

Feudal systems survive as long as those at the top crush all
resistance below, and any kind of 'progress' is anathema to the
system unless it is instituted from above, in which case its
sole raison d'etre is the continuance of the status quo.

In short, time marches on, but feudal systems do not.

I would suggest that pre-Meiji Japan was ripe for change, all
that was required was something big enough to throw the
balance, Usually this is a popular uprising against repression
and nothing acts as a catalyst more than the idea that another
way might be possible.

The degree of ensuing change, or its speed, is a result of the
ground that has to be made up - and the greater the ground, the
greater the impetus for change.

In my own experience, I witnessed something of a distant cousin
of this effect in the typesetting industry in the UK, dominated
by 2 trades unions who had divided up 'Fleet Street' (the
newspaper business) between them and who refused to accept
technological developments that weakened their powerbase.

This resistance went on until the appearance of the PC, at which
point the dam broke as it were, and a whole industry was swept
away overnight to vanish almost without trace.

As an aside, the battle was brought on by a major newspaper
publisher who built a new premesis founded on new computer
technology. He knew there would be strikes and
demonstrations, and military strategists have noticed that his
building fulfilled all the requirements of a fort built to withstand
a siege - not only walls and fences, but lines of approach,
everything - it was quickly dubbed "Fortress Wapping" and was
the site of the last stand of those particular unions.

In short Despotic regimes, however benign, serve only one
purpose, themselves.

Thomas

On Feb 8, 2005, at 8:55 PM, Gillian Rubinstein wrote:

> Maybe you could look at the Tokugawa period (1603 to 1868) and
> consider the characteristics of the Tokugawa system which made it
> relatively easy for the Meiji government to strong-arm the country into
> modernising: vertical hierarchies, neo-Confucianism, a relatively
> docile
> and obedient population, a thriving pre-industrial merchant economy
> etc, and some of the costs to the population - stifling of individual
> opinion and protest, often with great cruelty, a repressive society
> with
> elements of a police state, much informing on neighbours and so on,
> all of which have made it really hard for the Japanese to embrace
> Western style democracy in any realistic fashion or to have many forms
> of public protest.

Gilian, I agree with most of your Email, however it seems to me that
(after a couple of century of rest) from the middle of the 19th
century, protest has been a constant of Japanese history. From
Sonno-Joi to the AMPO protests in the 60s. The situation cooled down
only in the 70s, possibly because wealth tamed most rebellious
Japanese. Today, the only form of protest in Japan seem to be limited
of individual exploits of violent madness.

cepo

Cepo,

>
>From
> Sonno-Joi to the AMPO protests in the 60s. The situation cooled

down

> only in the 70s, possibly because wealth tamed most rebellious
> Japanese. Today, the only form of protest in Japan seem to be

limited

> of individual exploits of violent madness.
>

Of course you are right (anyone interested there's a good brief account
at
http://www.willamette.edu/~rloftus/ampo.html).

Mine was rather a generalised statement based on a politically active
friend who regrets it is so hard to get Japanese people to care about
social issues these days. Though the suggestions that the constitution
may be changed to allow more military activity seem to be arousing a
lot of opposition.

re your earlier remark on the Taliban: I often wonder how much the
sonno joi extremists could be compared with Islamic extremists now -
highly xenophobic, impatient with their moderate, compromising
leadership, hating the disrespect shown to the holy places/ Emperor,
and believing that acts of violence against individual foreigners would
cause the whole lot to leave. The differences I suppose are not
following a monotheistic religion and having far less access to the
media.

Contemporary accounts in English are full of terrified descriptions of
the "two-sworded ruffians" striding the streets of Yokohama and Edo.

I tried to think of some benevolent despots and came up with: Marcus
Aurelius, Elizabeth I, Kemal Ataturk, Lee Kuan Yew and the Sultan of
Brunei. (Some of the German princelings might qualify, but I can't
remember that history from high school days). Not a very convincing
list. Guess we'll have to stick with democracy: may be sadly flawed but
it's better than anything else. :)

Gillian

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On Feb 9, 2005, at 12:56 PM, Gillian Rubinstein wrote:

> I tried to think of some benevolent despots and came up with: Marcus
> Aurelius, Elizabeth I, Kemal Ataturk, Lee Kuan Yew and the Sultan of
> Brunei. (Some of the German princelings might qualify, but I can't
> remember that history from high school days). Not a very convincing
> list. Guess we'll have to stick with democracy: may be sadly flawed but
> it's better than anything else. :)
>
> Gillian

Forgive me for the OT; however you mentioned Lee Kwan Yew - one of my
absolute idols. He has just enforced a law against obesity. (All
overweight kids in Singapore need to exercise for 15 minutes during
recess, and their calories intake at school is severely controlled). He
would have been a dream Shogun (or Philosopher king).

Cheers, sorry again for the OT
cepo

>
> If anyone was OT it was me: but I think it's an interesting subject.

Yes, Lee Kwan Yew would make a dream shogun. And surely a
philosopher king (or queen) must be the all time best job. (But so many
people seem to mess it up. )

>

Cheers,

Gillian

> Forgive me for the OT; however you mentioned Lee Kwan Yew - one

of my

> absolute idols. He has just enforced a law against obesity. (All
> overweight kids in Singapore need to exercise for 15 minutes during
> recess, and their calories intake at school is severely controlled). He
> would have been a dream Shogun (or Philosopher king).
>
> Cheers, sorry again for the OT
> cepo
>
>
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On Feb 26, 2005, at 2:13 PM, Gillian Rubinstein wrote:

>> If anyone was OT it was me: but I think it's an interesting subject.
> Yes, Lee Kwan Yew would make a dream shogun. And surely a
> philosopher king (or queen) must be the all time best job. (But so many
> people seem to mess it up. )
>>
> Cheers,
>
> Gillian

That's because so many of our leaders do not have the education they
should have. They know nothing about history, culture, and can barely
speak their own language. And they know very little of the people they
rule because they all come from the upper class.

That was quite true of the Japanese 'feudal' leader as well. Hideyoshi
was a good 'pacifier' at home, and the fact that he was of lower
extraction might have helped him to deal successful with people, but
his ignorance in geography and history of China and Korea costed him
dearly.

Alexander the Great did pretty well. His main teacher was Aristotle...

cepo