Questions for story

Hi guys, as I said on my first post I'm writing a samurai story and I
need some help with a couple questions I have:

1. In what year did Tokugawa Ieyasu pass the edict that allied lords
had to spend some time in or near Edo?

2. How much time did they have to spend there?

3. Where did these lords stay? A kind of "guest" castle, or where...?

4. One of the fictional lords I will use has the surname Iwamura. I
know Iwamura was the place of a battle (I think this battle even took
place near the time frame of my story), I would like to know what
does Iwamura mean (or perhaps Iwa and mura separated, I think it has
to do something about a hawk?)

5. Is an army of some five thousand men and six hundred cavalry big
(for one single lord)? I think that, at least, six hundred horses
sound like a lot...

6. How many riflemen did lords have at their disposal? I know this
depends on the lord, but if you guys know of examples...

Miburo Sam

Sam-
It would be easy to give you all the answers, but I suspect
many like myself feel that whatever it is you are writing will suffer
from your lack of research. Best to study your history, try Sansom
and I think even Turbull would have the answer to most of your
questions. Iwamura BTW means Rock or "rocky slope" village if the
most common kanji are used.
pray for serf,
Tom

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Well, the questions are part of the research, and it's not as if I'm
beginning from zero; the story isn't per se a historical fiction,
it's mostly fantasy, but I would like some historical accuracy to
make it feel more realistic. Thanks anyway, I'll check out those
sources you mention.

Sam

--- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, tom helm wrote:
> Sam-
> It would be easy to give you all the answers, but I suspect
> many like myself feel that whatever it is you are writing will
suffer
> from your lack of research. Best to study your history, try Sansom
> and I think even Turbull would have the answer to most of your
> questions. Iwamura BTW means Rock or "rocky slope" village if the
> most common kanji are used.
> pray for serf,
> Tom
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

mura means village

>From: "Saitoh Hajime" <the_sam_99@...>
>Reply-To: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
>To: samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [samuraihistory] Questions for story
>Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2003 16:13:39 -0000
>
>Hi guys, as I said on my first post I'm writing a samurai story and I
>need some help with a couple questions I have:
>
>1. In what year did Tokugawa Ieyasu pass the edict that allied lords
>had to spend some time in or near Edo?
>
>2. How much time did they have to spend there?
>
>3. Where did these lords stay? A kind of "guest" castle, or where...?
>
>4. One of the fictional lords I will use has the surname Iwamura. I
>know Iwamura was the place of a battle (I think this battle even took
>place near the time frame of my story), I would like to know what
>does Iwamura mean (or perhaps Iwa and mura separated, I think it has
>to do something about a hawk?)
>
>5. Is an army of some five thousand men and six hundred cavalry big
>(for one single lord)? I think that, at least, six hundred horses
>sound like a lot...
>
>6. How many riflemen did lords have at their disposal? I know this
>depends on the lord, but if you guys know of examples...
>
>Miburo Sam
>

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." In what year did Tokugawa Ieyasu pass the edict that allied lords
had to spend some time in or near Edo?"

The Sankin Kotai system was a gradual process that developed over the reigns
of Ieyasu, Hidetada, and Iemitsu. Most of the regulations were established
by Iemitsu in the 1630's. For more info you might check out a book 'Feudal
Control in Tokugawa Japan' by Toshio Tsukahira. It will give you the whole
history of the system.

". How much time did they have to spend there"

It depended on the Daimyo. Most spent one year. Some for example the
Matsumae of Ezo, because of the distance, were exempt from attendance.

"Where did these lords stay? A kind of "guest" castle, or where...?"

They had there own permanent residence (sometimes even two). Remember the
Daimyo went back and forth to his domain but his family always lived in Edo.

"I would like to know what does Iwamura mean (or perhaps Iwa and mura
separated, I think it has
to do something about a hawk?)"

It depends on what kanji you use to write it. There are two historical
families by that name both written as 岩村 which can be translated as 'rock
village'. I wouldn't however worry to much about the meaning of the name.
Most samurai names were taken from the place they settled in.

As for the other questions I can't answer offhand but again check our
Tsukihiras tome.

If you are writing historical fiction may I suggest some writers that may
give you a feel for the genre. Ryotaro Shiba, Eiji Yoshikawa, Kunio Tsuji,
Shotaro Ikenami, Masuji Ibuse, Shusaku Endo. All of these have some works
translated into English.

Thanks a lot for your answers. As for a feel of the genre I have been
watching Kurosawa films, but I'm also eyeing Yoshikawa's "Musashi"
(that is set is the same timeframe).

For references these are the ones I have come up so far that have
grabbed my attention:

"Sekigahara 1600" - also set in the timeframe I'm looking for, and I
would also like some insight into samurai battle strategies. This
book apparently has this; do anyone here own the book?

"Samurai Warfare" - again, a good insight into samurai....well,
warfare.

"Samurai Warlords" and other Turnbull books.

"Musashi" - as you said, a feel for the genre.

p.d. I wanted to know the meaning of the name "Iwamura" in case I can
apply a metaphorical meaning to it. The meaning turns out to be
perfect (Rock village) for the story...in this way I would like to
find out meanings on other names, to make them "fit" the character
(another one is Makoto, which I believe means "honor").

Miburo Sam


--- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, "William&Mikiko Letham"
wrote:

> ." In what year did Tokugawa Ieyasu pass the edict that allied lords
> had to spend some time in or near Edo?"
>
> The Sankin Kotai system was a gradual process that developed over

the reigns

> of Ieyasu, Hidetada, and Iemitsu. Most of the regulations were

established

> by Iemitsu in the 1630's. For more info you might check out a

book 'Feudal

> Control in Tokugawa Japan' by Toshio Tsukahira. It will give you

the whole

> history of the system.
>
> ". How much time did they have to spend there"
>
> It depended on the Daimyo. Most spent one year. Some for example the
> Matsumae of Ezo, because of the distance, were exempt from

attendance.

>
> "Where did these lords stay? A kind of "guest" castle, or where...?"
>
> They had there own permanent residence (sometimes even two).

Remember the

> Daimyo went back and forth to his domain but his family always

lived in Edo.

>
> "I would like to know what does Iwamura mean (or perhaps Iwa and

mura

> separated, I think it has
> to do something about a hawk?)"
>
> It depends on what kanji you use to write it. There are two

historical

> families by that name both written as 蟯ｩ譚` which can be

translated as 'rock

> village'. I wouldn't however worry to much about the meaning of the

name.

> Most samurai names were taken from the place they settled in.
>
> As for the other questions I can't answer offhand but again check

our

> Tsukihiras tome.
>
> If you are writing historical fiction may I suggest some writers

that may

> give you a feel for the genre. Ryotaro Shiba, Eiji Yoshikawa, Kunio

Tsuji,

> Shotaro Ikenami, Masuji Ibuse, Shusaku Endo. All of these have some

works

> translated into English.

Saitoh Hajime wrote:

>
> p.d. I wanted to know the meaning of the name "Iwamura" in case I can
> apply a metaphorical meaning to it. The meaning turns out to be
> perfect (Rock village) for the story...in this way I would like to
> find out meanings on other names, to make them "fit" the character
> (another one is Makoto, which I believe means "honor").

"Makoto" means "truth."

Don't think too much about meaning and names. It gets obnoxious. Are girls named "Rose" really flowers? Are all guys
named "Thomas" twins?


Tony

Lol, I didn't know Thomas meant "twin".

It can get obnoxious, and I'm not planning on doing that on every
character, but remember that this is literature, so you can get away
with a person that has a name reflecting his/her personality, as a
symbolic gesture.

Thanks for the correction on the meaning of "Makoto", now I
understand why a certain character was named that way in "Rurouni
Kenshin"...;)

Miburo Sam


--- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, "Anthony J. Bryant"
wrote:

> Saitoh Hajime wrote:
>
> >
> > p.d. I wanted to know the meaning of the name "Iwamura" in case I

can

> > apply a metaphorical meaning to it. The meaning turns out to be
> > perfect (Rock village) for the story...in this way I would like to
> > find out meanings on other names, to make them "fit" the character
> > (another one is Makoto, which I believe means "honor").
>
> "Makoto" means "truth."
>
> Don't think too much about meaning and names. It gets obnoxious.

Are girls named "Rose" really flowers? Are all guys

> named "Thomas" twins?
>
>
> Tony

To me makoto means steadfast sincerity in the face of overwhelming
opposition like a writer who pens historical fiction without
researching the history or uses quaint translations of foreign names
to add "nuance" to his characters in spite of advice against doing
so. I have to wonder if we on this list are not your audience then
who is? I am sure we would all love to see more historical fiction
set in our favorite time and place but without the "groaners" seen in
Shogun and The Last Samurai.
Please don't take our criticism too harshly we are being
tongue in cheek, we just want to help...
-t

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Well, I think you are being unneccesarily rude, no offense, but you
can't judge my work without having even seen it or knowing what it is
about. I already said I'll research deeper, I already said that the
story is more fantasy that historical drama (MUCH more), whatever I
decide to do with my characters is my decision (I do take advice, but
that is not the same as changing everything because of it), this is
not a documentary, pal. Forgive me for asking some questions to
improve my work, last time I ask.

Have a nice day

--- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, tom helm wrote:
> To me makoto means steadfast sincerity in the face of overwhelming
> opposition like a writer who pens historical fiction without
> researching the history or uses quaint translations of foreign
names
> to add "nuance" to his characters in spite of advice against doing
> so. I have to wonder if we on this list are not your audience then
> who is? I am sure we would all love to see more historical fiction
> set in our favorite time and place but without the "groaners" seen
in
> Shogun and The Last Samurai.
> Please don't take our criticism too harshly we are being
> tongue in cheek, we just want to help...
> -t
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Now thats Makoto!
Which incidentally is the slogan of you old friends the
Shinsengumi. I am sorry if I offended you. look forward to reading
your book.
Tom

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sam,

It appears that you have picked several "popular" books on which to accumulate some background knowledge - and there is little problem with that.... However, I would recommend a recently published book to give you an overall feel and vision of the times: "Samurai, an illustrated history" by Mitsuo Kure, 2001; published by Tuttle - plenty of full coloured photos of re-enactors, banners and battle plans. And I suppose reading a few novels of the time would provide some faction base - Clavell's "SHOGUN" must be regarded as essential..

Good luck with the writing....
Rod Johnson

As an aside I used to enjoy the old western movies - I knew they were mostly factually incorrect - but it was entertainment!! So it is not unexpected that I look forward to "The Last Samurai" [and I will probably buy the video (or DVD) when it comes out]. I didn't look for wrist watches, telegraph poles and jet trails in the sky on "Waterloo", so I enjoyed it.... Treat "The Last Samurai" as entertainment, we couldn't look to Shakespear for history lessons! And it may even give another generation interest in "our" subject as the novel SHOGUN did........


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Well, now that I'm calmed down (indeed I was offended), I'll explain
to you what is the spirit of my story.

Have you seen Hayao Miyazaki's "Princess Mononoke"? You wouldn't know
precisely which timeframe the story belongs to if it wasn't for a
brief mention of Emperor Tensho (who I think ruled in the late
1500s...). However, the story's a fantasy: the lead
character "Ashitaka" is cursed by the toach of a Boar God (who was in
turn cursed by hate, a tatarigami), and is banished from his village,
embarking on a quest to find a way to lift his curse. In the way he
encounters tons of people (including some samurai warlords) and gods
(wolf, boar, and dear gods), yet there is never a heavy load of
historical info; in fact, there is almost none, save the details of
daily living in that time.

That's the kind of story I'm writing; the historical info is more of
a way to set myself into that timeframe, and to give the story
some "realistic" feel to something that is mostly fantastic
(werewolves, gods, etc...). Now, it if were something more along the
lines of "Ran" or "Musashi", your points would be very valid (and I'm
with you on that aspect completely), but it's just something else. I
apologize for the confusion, for I should have stated the nature of
my story more explicitely from the beginning.

And to answer your question, the target audience leans more towards
anime/manga people than samurai history scholars/fans.

p.d. so what the banner of the Shinsengumi has written is "Makoto"?

--- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, tom helm wrote:
> Now thats Makoto!
> Which incidentally is the slogan of you old friends the
> Shinsengumi. I am sorry if I offended you. look forward to reading
> your book.
> Tom
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Thank you, Rod, I'll check it out, perhaps tomorrow I go to Borders
to see if I can find at least one of these books.

I think I enjoy westerns more now that I see some parallel between
them and samurai; and your sentiments are mine, even if - as it's to
be expected - "The Last Samurai" misses the mark in historical
details, what really matters is that the story be good, and immerses
you in it. "Gladiator" is my favorite movie, yet I'm well aware of
the historical liberties they took for the sake of their story...

Miburo


--- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, "shogun.uk"
wrote:

> Sam,
>
> It appears that you have picked several "popular" books on which to

accumulate some background knowledge - and there is little problem
with that.... However, I would recommend a recently published book to
give you an overall feel and vision of the times: "Samurai, an
illustrated history" by Mitsuo Kure, 2001; published by Tuttle -
plenty of full coloured photos of re-enactors, banners and battle
plans. And I suppose reading a few novels of the time would provide
some faction base - Clavell's "SHOGUN" must be regarded as essential..

>
> Good luck with the writing....
> Rod Johnson
>
> As an aside I used to enjoy the old western movies - I knew they

were mostly factually incorrect - but it was entertainment!! So it is
not unexpected that I look forward to "The Last Samurai" [and I will
probably buy the video (or DVD) when it comes out]. I didn't look for
wrist watches, telegraph poles and jet trails in the sky
on "Waterloo", so I enjoyed it.... Treat "The Last Samurai" as
entertainment, we couldn't look to Shakespear for history lessons!
And it may even give another generation interest in "our" subject as
the novel SHOGUN did........

>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Er, should have said "deer gods" (shishigami?) instead of "dear
gods", lol!

Miburo


--- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, "Saitoh Hajime"
wrote:

> Well, now that I'm calmed down (indeed I was offended), I'll

explain

> to you what is the spirit of my story.
>
> Have you seen Hayao Miyazaki's "Princess Mononoke"? You wouldn't

know

> precisely which timeframe the story belongs to if it wasn't for a
> brief mention of Emperor Tensho (who I think ruled in the late
> 1500s...). However, the story's a fantasy: the lead
> character "Ashitaka" is cursed by the toach of a Boar God (who was

in

> turn cursed by hate, a tatarigami), and is banished from his

village,

> embarking on a quest to find a way to lift his curse. In the way he
> encounters tons of people (including some samurai warlords) and

gods

> (wolf, boar, and dear gods), yet there is never a heavy load of
> historical info; in fact, there is almost none, save the details of
> daily living in that time.
>
> That's the kind of story I'm writing; the historical info is more

of

> a way to set myself into that timeframe, and to give the story
> some "realistic" feel to something that is mostly fantastic
> (werewolves, gods, etc...). Now, it if were something more along

the

> lines of "Ran" or "Musashi", your points would be very valid (and

I'm

> with you on that aspect completely), but it's just something else.

I

> apologize for the confusion, for I should have stated the nature of
> my story more explicitely from the beginning.
>
> And to answer your question, the target audience leans more towards
> anime/manga people than samurai history scholars/fans.
>
> p.d. so what the banner of the Shinsengumi has written is "Makoto"?
>
>
>
> --- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, tom helm

wrote:

> > Now thats Makoto!
> > Which incidentally is the slogan of you old friends the
> > Shinsengumi. I am sorry if I offended you. look forward to

reading

> > your book.
> > Tom
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hajime san-
Since this flowed out of the "accuracy in movies" thread my
filters were on full bore and I missed the "fantasy" bit and I was
being a smart alec to boot, as often happens with email it doesn't
always come across that way. Don't forget that anime/manga fans and
Japanese history buffs are not always mutually exclusive
groups,though some are tougher critics.
Yes the banner of the Shinsengumi reads Makoto; truth,
sincerity, "loyalty to one's beliefs". The last interpretation being
the meaning I think they had in mind, believing the Tokugawa Shogun
to be a just and rightful leader. Someone who deserved their loyalty
and the proper agent of the Emperors' will.
-t

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

It sounds like a pretty cool book. ��������

"shogun.uk" <shogun.uk@...> wrote:Sam,

It appears that you have picked several "popular" books on which to accumulate some background knowledge - and there is little problem with that.... However, I would recommend a recently published book to give you an overall feel and vision of the times: "Samurai, an illustrated history" by Mitsuo Kure, 2001; published by Tuttle - plenty of full coloured photos of re-enactors, banners and battle plans. And I suppose reading a few novels of the time would provide some faction base - Clavell's "SHOGUN" must be regarded as essential..

Good luck with the writing....
Rod Johnson

As an aside I used to enjoy the old western movies - I knew they were mostly factually incorrect - but it was entertainment!! So it is not unexpected that I look forward to "The Last Samurai" [and I will probably buy the video (or DVD) when it comes out]. I didn't look for wrist watches, telegraph poles and jet trails in the sky on "Waterloo", so I enjoyed it.... Treat "The Last Samurai" as entertainment, we couldn't look to Shakespear for history lessons! And it may even give another generation interest in "our" subject as the novel SHOGUN did........


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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