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Yet more genealogy questions

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#1425 [2003-02-04 20:01:15]

Yet more genealogy questions

by kitsuno

Looking at the connection between the Tokugawa and the Maeda clans, I
find that a daughter of Tokugawa Hidetada (Ne- or Nene- hime [1599-
1622]) married Maeda Toshitsune [1593-1658]. does anyone know if his
sons Mitsumasa, Toshitsugi, and Toshiharu were sons of Hidetada's
daughter?

Second question - Hidetada's daughter Senhime married Honda
Tadatoshi, a nephew of Honda Tadamasa. Does anyone know who his
father was (which brother of Honda Tadamasa)?


Thanks for any assistance!

[Next #1426]

#1426 [2003-02-04 22:10:55]

Re: Yet more genealogy questions

by sinseism

Isn't she Tama-hime?Ne might be her another name ,but I have never
heard of.All of the three sons you reffer to are hers.But the name
Mitsmasa should be Mitsutaka.And Toshitsugi might be Toshitsugu.

Senhime's spouse is Honda Tadatoki.He is the son of Tadamasa,not
nephew.Tadamasa is the son of Tadakatsu.

hope this helps

Shinsei



--- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, "Kitsuno "
wrote:
> Looking at the connection between the Tokugawa and the Maeda clans,
I
> find that a daughter of Tokugawa Hidetada (Ne- or Nene- hime [1599-
> 1622]) married Maeda Toshitsune [1593-1658]. does anyone know if
his
> sons Mitsumasa, Toshitsugi, and Toshiharu were sons of Hidetada's
> daughter?
>
> Second question - Hidetada's daughter Senhime married Honda
> Tadatoshi, a nephew of Honda Tadamasa. Does anyone know who his
> father was (which brother of Honda Tadamasa)?
>
>
> Thanks for any assistance!

[Previous #1425] [Next #1430]

#1430 [2003-02-05 17:53:39]

Re: Yet more genealogy questions

by kitsuno

The Japanese book I'm looking at has her name in Kanji as "Ko"
followed by the 'repeat the previous' kanji, and the furigana
says "ne-" I'll try to put the Japanese here in SHIFT-JIS: ŽqX•P
It says she married Maeda Toshitsune: 利常 AKA Toshimitsu: 利光
It has her as the second daughter of Hidetada. I'll post this to see
if the Kanji posts along with it, and then take a look at what I have
for Senhime again. And I'm starting to realize that A.L. Sadler is
not the best author to look to for correct English romaji spellings
of Japanese names...


--- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, "Shinsei "
wrote:
> Isn't she Tama-hime?Ne might be her another name ,but I have never
> heard of.All of the three sons you reffer to are hers.But the name
> Mitsmasa should be Mitsutaka.And Toshitsugi might be Toshitsugu.
>
> Senhime's spouse is Honda Tadatoki.He is the son of Tadamasa,not
> nephew.Tadamasa is the son of Tadakatsu.
>
> hope this helps
>
> Shinsei
>
>
>
> --- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, "Kitsuno "
> wrote:
> > Looking at the connection between the Tokugawa and the Maeda
clans,
> I
> > find that a daughter of Tokugawa Hidetada (Ne- or Nene- hime
[1599-
> > 1622]) married Maeda Toshitsune [1593-1658]. does anyone know if
> his
> > sons Mitsumasa, Toshitsugi, and Toshiharu were sons of Hidetada's
> > daughter?
> >
> > Second question - Hidetada's daughter Senhime married Honda
> > Tadatoshi, a nephew of Honda Tadamasa. Does anyone know who his
> > father was (which brother of Honda Tadamasa)?
> >
> >
> > Thanks for any assistance!

[Previous #1426] [Next #1433]

#1433 [2003-02-06 08:37:10]

Re: Yet more genealogy questions

by sinseism

Hello
The author is right.The kanji Žq can be read as "ne" when it
means "mouse" as one of the 12 "eto" mascots.And as I searched by the
word ŽqX•P,some webpages says Nenehime is Tamahime's another
name.She is also called Tentoku-in.

Shinsei


--- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, "Kitsuno "
wrote:
> The Japanese book I'm looking at has her name in Kanji as "Ko"
> followed by the 'repeat the previous' kanji, and the furigana
> says "ne-" I'll try to put the Japanese here in SHIFT-JIS: ŽqX•P
> It says she married Maeda Toshitsune: 利常 AKA Toshimitsu: 利光
> It has her as the second daughter of Hidetada. I'll post this to
see
> if the Kanji posts along with it, and then take a look at what I
have
> for Senhime again. And I'm starting to realize that A.L. Sadler is
> not the best author to look to for correct English romaji spellings
> of Japanese names...
>
>
> --- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, "Shinsei "
> wrote:
> > Isn't she Tama-hime?Ne might be her another name ,but I have
never
> > heard of.All of the three sons you reffer to are hers.But the
name
> > Mitsmasa should be Mitsutaka.And Toshitsugi might be Toshitsugu.
> >
> > Senhime's spouse is Honda Tadatoki.He is the son of Tadamasa,not
> > nephew.Tadamasa is the son of Tadakatsu.
> >
> > hope this helps
> >
> > Shinsei
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, "Kitsuno "
> > wrote:
> > > Looking at the connection between the Tokugawa and the Maeda
> clans,
> > I
> > > find that a daughter of Tokugawa Hidetada (Ne- or Nene- hime
> [1599-
> > > 1622]) married Maeda Toshitsune [1593-1658]. does anyone know
if
> > his
> > > sons Mitsumasa, Toshitsugi, and Toshiharu were sons of
Hidetada's
> > > daughter?
> > >
> > > Second question - Hidetada's daughter Senhime married Honda
> > > Tadatoshi, a nephew of Honda Tadamasa. Does anyone know who
his
> > > father was (which brother of Honda Tadamasa)?
> > >
> > >
> > > Thanks for any assistance!

[Previous #1430] [Next #1434]

#1434 [2003-02-06 10:57:55]

Re: Yet more genealogy questions

by kitsuno

Got it, I misread 'legitimate child / hier'(Chakushi)
as 'nephew'(Oi) - not sure how I did that. But this may be a stupid
question, but how did Senhime marry both Tadatoki and Hideyori when
they both died in 1615? (also, was Tadatoki also known as Tadatoshi?
A.L. Sadler, in his biography of Ieyasu has it as Tadatoshi. Not
that I trust his spelling all that much...)


--- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, "Shinsei "
wrote:
> Isn't she Tama-hime?Ne might be her another name ,but I have never
> heard of.All of the three sons you reffer to are hers.But the name
> Mitsmasa should be Mitsutaka.And Toshitsugi might be Toshitsugu.
>
> Senhime's spouse is Honda Tadatoki.He is the son of Tadamasa,not
> nephew.Tadamasa is the son of Tadakatsu.
>
> hope this helps
>
> Shinsei
>
>
>
> --- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, "Kitsuno "
> wrote:
> > Looking at the connection between the Tokugawa and the Maeda
clans,
> I
> > find that a daughter of Tokugawa Hidetada (Ne- or Nene- hime
[1599-
> > 1622]) married Maeda Toshitsune [1593-1658]. does anyone know if
> his
> > sons Mitsumasa, Toshitsugi, and Toshiharu were sons of Hidetada's
> > daughter?
> >
> > Second question - Hidetada's daughter Senhime married Honda
> > Tadatoshi, a nephew of Honda Tadamasa. Does anyone know who his
> > father was (which brother of Honda Tadamasa)?
> >
> >
> > Thanks for any assistance!

[Previous #1433] [Next #1436]

#1436 [2003-02-06 15:33:38]

Re: Yet more genealogy questions

by kitsuno

Oops, disregard that. There were two Honda Tadatokis, the one who
died in 1615 was AKA Tadatomo, and was Honda Tadatoki's Uncle.
Solves that problem. The Tadatoki married to Senhime died in 1626.
Senhime was actually his half first cousin, once removed, by the
way.It looks like relations married with some frequency during the
sengoku period.

--- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, "Kitsuno "
wrote:
> Got it, I misread 'legitimate child / hier'(Chakushi)
> as 'nephew'(Oi) - not sure how I did that. But this may be a
stupid
> question, but how did Senhime marry both Tadatoki and Hideyori when
> they both died in 1615? (also, was Tadatoki also known as
Tadatoshi?
> A.L. Sadler, in his biography of Ieyasu has it as Tadatoshi. Not
> that I trust his spelling all that much...)
>
>
> --- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, "Shinsei "
> wrote:
> > Isn't she Tama-hime?Ne might be her another name ,but I have
never
> > heard of.All of the three sons you reffer to are hers.But the
name
> > Mitsmasa should be Mitsutaka.And Toshitsugi might be Toshitsugu.
> >
> > Senhime's spouse is Honda Tadatoki.He is the son of Tadamasa,not
> > nephew.Tadamasa is the son of Tadakatsu.
> >
> > hope this helps
> >
> > Shinsei
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com, "Kitsuno "
> > wrote:
> > > Looking at the connection between the Tokugawa and the Maeda
> clans,
> > I
> > > find that a daughter of Tokugawa Hidetada (Ne- or Nene- hime
> [1599-
> > > 1622]) married Maeda Toshitsune [1593-1658]. does anyone know
if
> > his
> > > sons Mitsumasa, Toshitsugi, and Toshiharu were sons of
Hidetada's
> > > daughter?
> > >
> > > Second question - Hidetada's daughter Senhime married Honda
> > > Tadatoshi, a nephew of Honda Tadamasa. Does anyone know who
his
> > > father was (which brother of Honda Tadamasa)?
> > >
> > >
> > > Thanks for any assistance!

[Previous #1434]


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