Recent Update - Samurai Archives

A 'clan timeline' for the Oda Clan of the 16th century has been added
to the 'Clan Timelines' section, which can be viewed here:

http://www.samurai-archives.com/clantime.html

If anything appears to be missing, or just plain wrong, give a shout.

I've got a question regarding the relationships
between Kinoshita Tokichiro (the future
Hashiba/Toyotomi Hideyoshi) and his wife One, and
Maeda Toshiie and his wife Matsu. Most of what I've
read that touches on the subject is fictional works,
notably Eiji Yoshikawa's "Taiko" and Taiga Drama. If
you listen to Yoshikawa's story and the "Hideyoshi"
Taiga drama (1996), One was pursued by both Tokichiro
and Toshiie, and Tokichiro won her heart and married
her. It's portrayed as part of his charm, how he could
get this wonderfully beautiful (and smart) woman who
was above his station to love the little monkey, etc.

After watching the first 4 episodes of "Toshiie to
Matsu" (1997, I think?) the story it tells is that One
and Matsu were vying for Toshiie's affections, and
Matsu won. One was ordered by Nobunaga to marry
"Saru-dono" (Monkey Lord) Tokichiro, and she was very
unhappy about it.

I know that all this is fiction. My question is, is
there anything academic that documents the relations
between the 4, and what is the truth about their
relationships? Or is it all left open to fictional
interpretation? I figured the Ehon Taiko-ki wouldn't
go into great detail about how the great Taiko's wife
didn't want to marry him.

It is very interesting to watch the two different
Taiga Drama's and see the differences. Quite funny,
actually.

Nate

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Not being an academic I can't say about sources though I think this one
topic that would be hard to ascertain the true facts. Andrea Brascaro did
edit some book of Hideyoshis letters. I've never seen it but I hazard to
guess it wouldn't shed any light either. As for the drama itself, (which is
this years by the way episode 33 aired sunday night) I'm rather
dissappointed especially in the battle scenes or lack thereof, Okehazama was
a mess and Shizugatake wasn't even there. This was a let down following the
CG enhanced battles from 2000s Aoi Tokugawa Sandai, and last years Hojo
Tokimune. However my wife loves it, and its been a hit in the ratings
staying in the top five dramas. Taiga drama has basically become a 'trendy'
jidaigeki drama. I wonder what NHK will do with next years Musashi? Another
drama I saw had Hideyoshi in love with Ochi, Nobunagas sister. I don't think
they will ever make a drama about the 'relationship' between Nobunaga and
Toshiie though..

----- Original Message -----
From: Nate Ledbetter <ltdomer98@...>
To: <samuraihistory@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, August 26, 2002 10:52 AM
Subject: [samuraihistory] One vs. Matsu?


> I've got a question regarding the relationships
> between Kinoshita Tokichiro (the future
> Hashiba/Toyotomi Hideyoshi) and his wife One, and
> Maeda Toshiie and his wife Matsu. Most of what I've
> read that touches on the subject is fictional works,
> notably Eiji Yoshikawa's "Taiko" and Taiga Drama. If
> you listen to Yoshikawa's story and the "Hideyoshi"
> Taiga drama (1996), One was pursued by both Tokichiro
> and Toshiie, and Tokichiro won her heart and married
> her. It's portrayed as part of his charm, how he could
> get this wonderfully beautiful (and smart) woman who
> was above his station to love the little monkey, etc.
>
> After watching the first 4 episodes of "Toshiie to
> Matsu" (1997, I think?) the story it tells is that One
> and Matsu were vying for Toshiie's affections, and
> Matsu won. One was ordered by Nobunaga to marry
> "Saru-dono" (Monkey Lord) Tokichiro, and she was very
> unhappy about it.
>
> I know that all this is fiction. My question is, is
> there anything academic that documents the relations
> between the 4, and what is the truth about their
> relationships? Or is it all left open to fictional
> interpretation? I figured the Ehon Taiko-ki wouldn't
> go into great detail about how the great Taiko's wife
> didn't want to marry him.
>
> It is very interesting to watch the two different
> Taiga Drama's and see the differences. Quite funny,
> actually.
>
> Nate
>
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>
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While I sit around the house reading books on swords and armour my wife reads
"The women of Heian Kyo" and "Sengoku Busho no Onna-tachi". I don't watch the
Taiga dramas anymore and don't know anything about One.
However my in house expert insists that Hideyoshi was a good match for her
at that point in her life, not a step down. She was charmed she thinks,
afterall Hideyoshi must have possesed some charm to become the leader he was,
and take control of the country.
She believes that the two women never competed, they met later in life and
became friends then.
She also says "tell you friends to stop watching television..."

Tom

I'd agree with this (- the female point of view perhaps?) I read the
translation of Hideyoshi's letters a while ago and what remains in my
mind is a man of some charm, interested in all aspects of the lives of
the women of his household. (I believe it didn't stop him putting some
of them to death later.)

G

--



Gillian Rubinstein